The Wednesday Conversation

Episode 561: Christian Zionism

Wed, 18 Feb 2026 07:00:00 +0000

How should Christians think about Israel?

Questions about the nation of Israel and its place in the world have resurfaced following the October 2023 attack by Hamas and Israel’s response. These events have precipitated a rise in anti-Semitism and prompted pointed conversations around Zionism. How should Christians relate to the modern state of Israel? In this episode, Bob responds to a listener request for some perspective on that question. He defines Zionism, addresses four common critiques, and offers three compelling reasons for Christian Zionism.

Chapters:
(0:00) How Should Christians Think about Israel?
(1:18) What is Zionism and Why is it in the News?
(7:00) Answering Four Critiques
(27:22) Christian and Zionist?
(33:32) Closing Thoughts

Articles & Resources: https://firstthings.com/the-patriarch-and-the-palestinians/

Episode 560: Chris Says Goodbye

Wed, 11 Feb 2026 07:00:30 +0000

In Chris’s final episode, we reflect on his journey over the past 11+ years.

In this episode, we say goodbye to Pastor Chris Hemmelman as he prepares to move from Bellevue, Nebraska to Woodstock, Georgia. We reflect on his journey from church planting resident to lead pastor at First City Church — and what he’s learned along the way. Chris shares what he’s learned about church planting, leadership development, risk-taking, and the slow, relational work of faithful ministry. The conversation closes with reflections on gratitude, presence, and trusting God in seasons of transition.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Chris’s Farewell Episode
(2:00) Discernment, Risk, and Residency
(7:45) Lessons in Leadership Development
(10:30) What Would You Tell Yourself 10 Years Ago?
(15:20) Favorite Podcast Moments
(22:40) Transition, Presence, and Prayers for What’s Next

Episode 559: Harmonizing the Gospels

Wed, 04 Feb 2026 07:00:00 +0000

How do we make sense of the differences within the four Gospels?

Readers of the Bible can't help but notice that Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John sometimes tell the same stories differently. Was there one angel at the tomb (Matthew), or two (Luke)? Did Jesus cleanse the Temple at the beginning of his ministry (John), or near the end (Matthew)? In this episode, we explore how to make sense of this variety within the Gospel accounts. We discuss apparent contradictions, the literary conventions of first-century biographies, and how to read the Gospels with wise confidence in the reliability of Scripture.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: The Problem of Harmonization
(4:27) Not Video Camera Footage
(10:50) Place Names and Geography
(14:25) Order, Grouping, and Theological Structure
(21:09) Letting Matthew Be Matthew

Episode 558: American Solidarity

Wed, 28 Jan 2026 07:00:00 +0000

Why does American life feel so fractured, and what can Christians do about it?

American society feels increasingly polarized, anxious, and divided — and many people sense that the problem is deeper than politics. In this episode, we explore the idea that what’s really fraying is solidarity. Drawing on James Davison Hunter’s Democracy and Solidarity and a recent article by Jake Meador, we examine three competing visions for renewing American solidarity. We argue that neither free-market individualism nor ethnic nationalism offers a meaningful solution, and we discuss how Christianity provides a framework for a distinctive and robust solidarity.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: The Future of The Wednesday Conversation
(7:45) Liberal Individualism and the Loss of Solidarity
(14:55) Nationalism as a False Solution
(22:34) A Christian Vision of Dependence
(30:35) What Solidarity Looks Like in Everyday Life
(34:00) Stitching the Fabric Back Together Locally

Episode 557: Evangelicals’ Elite Problem

Wed, 21 Jan 2026 07:00:00 +0000

Do evangelicals really lack cultural elites — and if so, does it matter?

An essay in First Things argues that evangelicals have failed to cultivate elites in America’s most influential institutions, leaving them underrepresented in culture-shaping domains like media, academia, and politics. In this episode, we examine author Aaron Renn’s claims, question his definition of “elite,” and explore where the argument resonates — and where it falls apart. We discuss populism within evangelicalism, the absence of a robust theology of vocation, the tension evangelicals feel toward ambition and power, and reflect on how the gospel reframes ambition, faithfulness, and cultural impact.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Evangelical Elites?
(8:07) Why Evangelicals Struggle with Power
(19:08) Ambition, Leadership, and Discernment
(26:26) The Need for Flagship Churches
(32:29) The Gospel’s Reframing of Success

Episode 556: The Lost Generation

Wed, 14 Jan 2026 07:00:00 +0000

Are white millennial men becoming a “lost generation”?

A widely shared essay in Compact magazine contends that white millennial men have borne an overlooked cost of the DEI era — facing stalled careers, closed doors, and deep vocational disillusionment. In this episode, we examine the article’s claims and reflect on why this story has resonated so strongly. We discuss meritocracy, generational resentment, the spiritual danger of letting vocational injustice define our identity, and how the gospel speaks to disappointment and unfair systems.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: The Lost Generation
(4:40) A Listener’s Story
(12:05) Journalism, Academia, and Hollywood: The Evidence
(20:00) Meritocracy, Resentment, and Generational Fallout
(22:45) What the Gospel Offers in an Unfair World

Episode 555: From the Archives | The Art of Asking Good Questions

Wed, 07 Jan 2026 07:00:00 +0000

Why is question-asking vital to spiritual growth and formation?

Asking questions is an important part of forming good relationships. Yet sometimes we fail to ask questions or ask the wrong kind of questions in an effort to avoid conflict or out of fear. In this episode from 2016, we discuss the art of asking good questions — how it shows love and curiosity, why it’s essential to our spiritual formation, and how we can be attuned to the Holy Spirit as we do it.

Episode 554: 2025 in Review

Wed, 31 Dec 2025 07:00:00 +0000

What were some of the highlights of 2025?

On the last day of 2025, we spend some time reflecting on the past year. In this episode, we talk about impactful books we read, memorable moments in ministry, insights from Scripture, and longings we have for ourselves and our churches.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Chippers?
(4:58) Books We Read in 2025
(10:57) Key Ministry Moments
(17:03) Engaging with Scripture
(20:42) People & Places
(25:05) Longings

Episode 553: Pastoral Transitions

Wed, 24 Dec 2025 07:00:00 +0000

How should a pastor process a calling to leave a church and transition to a new ministry setting?

Pastoral transitions can be difficult for churches and leaders to navigate. Sometimes pastors move on for the wrong reasons. But sometimes, the Spirit of God is on the move. How can we discern the difference? In this episode, Chris opens up about a forthcoming transition in his own ministry. We discuss the importance of relational trust, self-awareness and discernment, inviting community into the process, and the practical realities of leading through change.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Christmastime = Snack Time
(1:02) Chris is Departing Omaha
(4:49) Moving from Good to Good
(14:54) The Stages of Reckoning with a Pastoral Shift
(19:33) Questions Pastors Should Be Asking
(29:31) Questions Churches Should Be Asking

Episode 552: Family Planning (Part 2)

Wed, 17 Dec 2025 07:00:06 +0000

How should Christians approach contraception and family planning?

Unless a Christian couple has taken the time to investigate contraceptive and family planning options, it can be hard to know what exists, what is safe, and what is ethical. In part two of this two-part episode, we continue our conversation about how to honor God in our approach to family planning. We discuss the risks of hormonal birth control and respond to some additional listener questions about when to start having kids — and also whether it's OK to be done.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Resetting the Discussion
(1:45) Fertility Awareness vs. Hormonal Birth Control
(8:13) When Are You Ready to Have Kids?
(17:30) Is It OK to Be Done Having Kids?
(22:38) Christian Freedom in Family Planning

Episode 551: Family Planning (Part 1)

Wed, 10 Dec 2025 07:00:00 +0000

How should Christians approach contraception and family planning?

Unless a Christian couple has taken the time to investigate contraceptive and family planning options, it can be hard to know what exists, what is safe, and what is ethical. In part one of this two-part episode, we address a listener's question about how to honor God in our approach to family planning. We discuss the predominant cultural narratives about contraception, how a Christian view is different, and why the fertility awareness method offers a unique wisdom in this area.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Listener Justin Has a Question
(3:16) The Cultural Starting Point for Contraception
(9:03) Strengths & Weaknesses of Protestant Thought
(13:33) Reflecting on Our Assumptions about Birth Control
(21:44) Jenn Newman Joins Us to Talk About Fertility Awareness

Episode 550: The Casino Economy

Wed, 03 Dec 2025 07:00:00 +0000

How can we resist the gamification of our economy — and help others do the same?

The advent of digital technology has incentivized ease and encouraged isolation. Young people, especially young men, have become socially risk-averse — spending more time alone and cultivating negative habits on their devices. In this episode, we engage a Derek Thompson Substack article that explores the connection between online betting and social isolation. We discuss the fight for young men's souls, the need for embodied discipleship, and how the church can be a counter-cultural champion of relationships and community.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Keep it Up, Young Christian Men
(3:07) We’ve Forgotten How to Feel Lonely
(7:05) The Loss of the Pro-Social Script
(16:19) Why Embodied Discipleship Matters
(21:13) Disempowering the Digitization of Our Lives
(27:33) Concluding Reflections

Episode 549: Christian Maturity Is a Journey, Not a Destination

Wed, 26 Nov 2025 07:00:00 +0000

How can we submit to and enjoy the slow process of sanctification?

It’s not uncommon for Christians to feel discouraged by their progress (or lack thereof) in sanctification. But what if our vision of maturity focused less on the destination and more on slow growth over time? In this episode, we use the Sermon on the Mount to consider Christian discipleship and maturity. We discuss Jesus's image of discipleship as a path or road, how to handle discouragement along the way, and the joy of not taking ourselves too seriously.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Follow-Up on AR-15's
(5:49) Reframing Sanctification as a Journey
(15:25) The Journey is Slow
(20:57) We Will Reach the Destination
(27:33) How to Enjoy the Process

Episode 548: TWC Commentary | AI-First or People-First?

Wed, 19 Nov 2025 07:00:00 +0000

How can we advocate for a people-first economy?

Artificial intelligence is disrupting our vocational and social worlds — and as it starts to dominate industries, more people are trying to discern its proper limits and boundaries. Intuitively, we are hesitant about the increasing growth of AI. But why? Is it because we sense that people should do our work? In this episode, Bob weaves together two articles to discuss the contrast between building an AI-first culture and a people-first culture. Along the way, we consider the importance of a Christian anthropology, the growing questions about AI's economic impact, and how Christians can be champions of others in their lives and workspaces.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: What Do We Do about AI?
(5:39) We’re Heading Toward an AI-First World
(11:04) Choose the Person over the Non-Person
(15:46) A Principle for Engaging AI
(21:57) The ROI on AI
(27:49) A People-First Approach

Articles & Resources:
https://www.newyorker.com/news/the-financial-page/the-ai-profits-drought-and-the-lessons-of-history
https://mereorthodoxy.com/wendell-berrys-unanswered-question

Episode 547: TWC Commentary | Roman Catholics & Marian Devotion

Wed, 12 Nov 2025 07:00:00 +0000

The Vatican clarified its stance on the virgin Mary—where do Protestants agree & disagree?

Last week, the Vatican's Dicastery for the Doctrine of Faith released a document clarifying Roman Catholic teaching about Mary the mother of Jesus. Mariology has been a point of contention in Protestant/Catholic relations, but the Mater Populi Fidelis document reveals some promising reforms. It also fails to go far enough. In this episode, Bob commends three specific areas of reform, points out three areas of ongoing disagreement, and encourages Protestant/Catholic debate and conversation.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: The Release of Mater Populi Fidelis
(4:34) Three Encouraging Reforms to Marian Devotion
(13:04) Where We Think the Vatican Still Missed
(24:23) What Protestants Can Glean

Articles & Resources:
https://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2025/11/04/251104a.html

Episode 546: Common Sense Gun Regulation?

Wed, 05 Nov 2025 07:00:00 +0000

Why are so many Christians unwilling to bend on the issue of guns?

In the wake of Charlie Kirk’s murder and other recent instances of gun violence, the debate over gun regulation is raging once again. The right to bear arms is constitutionally protected and deeply ingrained in American culture — but does that mean all guns should be permitted? In this episode, we respond to a listener question about where Christians should stand on gun control. We discuss biblical wisdom and gun regulation, the interplay of the gun debate with societal virtue, and why “rights” don’t always align with human flourishing.

Chapters:
(0:00) Listener Sophia Has a Question
(3:20) Teeing Up the Gun Control Debate
(7:40) Why Christians Should Support Reasonable Gun Regulations
(12:17) The Case Against Assault Weapons
(16:10) Why We Are Still Pro-Gun
(20:00) Guns and Virtue

Resources:
Gun Control and the Right to Bear Arms — Good Faith Debates https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOMePdBBLnI

Episode 545: From the Archives | Worshiping in the Tradition

Wed, 29 Oct 2025 06:00:00 +0000

How should the Reformation shape how we worship today?

It’s always good to know and understand our heritage when it comes to worship. Why do we structure our worship gatherings the way we do? Why do we sing together as a congregation? Should we take communion every week? In this episode from 2020, we talk about the book ‘Reformation Worship’ and look at what principles and ideas we can take from the Reformation and put into practice in modern day worship.

Episode 544: Survival in an Age of Extinction?

Wed, 22 Oct 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Technology is threatening our humanity — how do we push back?

The digital revolution is forcing the human race toward a civilizational bottleneck, Ross Douthat contends in a recent New York Times article. What survives depends on our deliberate choices. Unless we "fight for a future where human things and human beings survive and flourish," much of what we love will be lost. In this episode, we discuss Douthat's insights about how the virtual replaces the real, why we put up with this digital substitution, and how AI accelerates the process. We close by considering how Christians can help preserve the practices and pursuits that make us truly human.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Bob's Recent Cycling Accident
(4:47) The Digital Age as a Civilizational Bottleneck
(16:38) How The Virtual Replaces the Real
(21:30) Intentional & Purposeful Stewardship
(31:37) Preserving the Really Human Things

Episode 543: An Interview with Trevin Wax (Part 2)

Wed, 15 Oct 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Bob interviews Trevin Wax about his new book, The Gospel Way Catechism.

Trevin Wax is Vice President of Resources and Marketing at the North American Mission Board and a well-known author, speaker, and cultural commentator. He also serves (along with Bob) as a fellow at The Keller Center for Cultural Apologetics. In this episode, Bob and Trevin talk apologetics. They discuss Trevin’s newest project "The Gospel Way Catechism" and its unique approach to counter-formation. They also explain the role of cultural apologetics in explaining and defending the Christian faith.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: What is Counter-Catechesis?
(7:26) How to Decide What to Put In a Catechism
(14:56) Who Should Be Using Catechisms?
(21:40) Trevin’s Contribution to “The Gospel After Christendom”
(25:00) Explaining Cultural Apologetics
(30:45) Lesslie Newbigin's Missiology

Episode 542: An Interview with Trevin Wax (Part 1)

Wed, 08 Oct 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Bob interviews Trevin Wax about his life, leadership, writing, and formative influences.

Trevin Wax is Vice President of Resources and Marketing at the North American Mission Board and a well-known author, speaker, and cultural commentator. He also serves (along with Bob) as a fellow at The Keller Center for Cultural Apologetics. During Trevin's recent visit to Nebraska for a TGC pastor's quarterly, we invited him to join the podcast to discuss his life and work. In this episode, we hear about Trevin’s upbringing, his writing, his experiences in ministry, and his vision for the next few decades.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Kelsey’s Cookies (Again)
(1:28) Trevin’s Family and Church Background
(10:18) Developing the Discipline of Writing
(21:46) Experiences with and Work with the Keller Center
(37:59) What’s Next?

Episode 541: Why We Catechize

Wed, 01 Oct 2025 06:00:00 +0000

What are catechisms and why do we use them?

To those unfamiliar with the term, “catechism” can seem like a strange word. Simply put, catechisms are question-and-answer tools that communicate Christian theology in simple ways. In this episode, we respond to a listener question about the origins of catechisms and creeds. We discuss why the Reformation led to a golden age of catechisms, what makes catechisms important, and how they connect us to historic Christianity and spur us to deeper worship.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Kelsey's Cookies
(1:55) Catechizing Catechumens with Catechisms
(12:50) Some Important Creeds & Catechisms
(18:56) Laying a Foundation for Theology & Discipleship
(29:29) Catechisms Tether Us to the Historic Church

Episode 540: TWC Commentary | The Aftermath of an Assassination

Wed, 24 Sep 2025 06:00:00 +0000

In the wake of Charlie Kirk's assassination, how do we process our emotions, responses, and reactions?

On September 10, 2025, conservative political activist and outspoken Christian Charlie Kirk was murdered during a campus event at Utah Valley University. Some people are feeling shock, anger, fear, grief, and lament; others are celebrating or mocking. How do we make sense of what we’re feeling? How do we respond to what others are saying? And what does this moment portend for American politics and the future of civic debate? In this episode, Bob engages these questions and offers some commentary and perspective.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: First Things First
(5:44) Who Was Charlie Kirk ?
(12:36) What Does His Assassination Reveal?
(27:06) Temptations We Should Resist
(39:22) Parting Thoughts

Articles & Resources:
https://www.digitalliturgies.net/p/accelerants-and-tethers
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/16/opinion/charlie-kirk-assassination-left-violence.html
https://brianmattson.substack.com/p/theythem

Episode 539: Secular Praise Music?

Wed, 17 Sep 2025 06:00:00 +0000

If you’ve listened to the radio lately, perhaps you’ve noticed that pop music is sounding a lot like worship music. Some of the year's most popular songs use biblical imagery, emotive builds, and vocal choirs—not unlike what you might hear in church. On this week’s episode, we discuss a recent article that traces this trend. We explore why music producers are mimicking worship music and what it suggests about our cultural moment.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Myrtle & Cypress
(3:21) Is "Secular Praise Music" Even a Thing?
(13:24) What’s Driving the Change in Pop Music
(19:03) What Music Says About Our Collective Longings
(30:05) We Can Worship Even When Songs Are Hard to Sing

Article:
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/music/article/everyone-is-listening-to-secular-praise-music-yes-even-you-110058855.html

Episode 538: Protestant Spiritual Formation

Wed, 10 Sep 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Over the past half-century, evangelical Christians have rediscovered spiritual formation. Richard Foster, Dallas Willard, John Ortberg, and more recently John Mark Comer have helped re-emphasize spiritual practices and the interior life. But why does so much popular writing and teaching on spiritual formation lean on Catholic sources – mystics and monks and Merton? Is there a distinctly Protestant stream of spiritual formation that we can rediscover? If so, what might it teach us? In this episode, we interact with a new book from Matthew Bingham, A Heart Aflame for God. Bingham asserts that there IS a deep Protestant tradition of spiritual formation, and one of its distinctives is the centrality of Scripture. In this episode, we discuss why we tend to minimize Scripture in spiritual formation, why the Puritans saw Scripture as central to spiritual formation, and how we can practically foreground the Scriptures in our spiritual practices.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Have We Lost the Thread on Spiritual Formation?
(4:26) The Primacy of the Word of God
(13:23) Some Critiques of a Word-Centric Spiritual Formation
(20:43) What the Puritans Have to Say
(26:22) Let the Word of Christ Dwell in You Richly

Episode 537: Baptism and Re-Baptism

Wed, 03 Sep 2025 06:00:00 +0000

In credobaptist traditions, we baptize new Christians upon their profession of faith in Christ. But what happens when, a few years later, a new experience of God's grace makes me question my prior baptism? How can we separate our subjective experiences of God’s promises from the objective nature of those promises? In this episode, we respond to a listener question and discuss how the Reformation tradition understood baptism, what the animating force of baptism is, and the connections between baptism and discipleship.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Why We Love Our Listeners
(2:46) Can/Should I Get Re-Baptized?
(5:57) Who’s Speaking in Baptism?
(13:31) Differences Among Paedobaptist Traditions
(20:22) What "Conversion" Is and Isn't
(25:34) Coming Back to the Great Commission

Episode 536: Coram Deo’s 20th Anniversary (Part 2)

Wed, 27 Aug 2025 06:00:00 +0000

August 2025 marks Coram Deo Church’s 20th birthday. On this episode, we reflect further on God’s grace to Coram Deo over the past two decades. We talk about what we’re grateful for, what years were the most fun, what aspects of Coram Deo turned out differently than we expected, and why the "institutional" aspect of a church is crucial to city renewal.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: David's Reign
(2:19) What We're Grateful For
(10:42) The Church As Institution
(14:16) What We're Surprised By
(19:15) What Was the Most Fun
(24:38) Listener Take-Aways

Episode 535: Coram Deo’s 20th Anniversary (Part 1)

Wed, 20 Aug 2025 06:00:00 +0000

August 2025 marks Coram Deo Church’s 20th birthday. On this episode, we reflect on God's grace to Coram Deo over the past two decades. We discuss the circumstances of the church's founding, the ups and downs of starting and leading a church, and what’s changed in the cultural and ministry environment between 2005 and 2025.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: Happy Birthday, Coram Deo
(2:21) How Coram Deo Got Started
(10:06) What Ministry Looked Like in 2005
(18:35) Leading a Growing Church
(24:32) Joys and Trials
(30:33) Church Planting: Then Vs. Now

Episode 534: A Long Obedience in the Same Direction... at Work

Wed, 13 Aug 2025 12:51:00 +0000

If it hasn't happened to you yet... wait for it. Sometime in your mid-30's, life starts to feel mundane. You find yourself asking: How did I get here? Do I like what I do? Do I still want this job? Despite all the cliches, "mid-life crisis" is real. The world urges you to try something new - a new job, a new hobby, maybe even a new spouse. But what if God has a different invitation—one that invites you to interrogate your restlessness? In this episode, we answer a listener question about how to persist at work. We discuss stewardship, settling, friendship, and the wisdom of knowing your portion (Ecclesiastes 9:9).

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: I Guess This is a Mid-Life Crisis Podcast
(2:53) Mid-Life as an Invitation to Settledness
(12:35) Settling IN vs. Settling FOR
(21:00) What Does the Lord Want from Me Next?
(25:11) Find People Who Aren’t Impressed with You
(31:02) What Is Your Portion?

Episode 533: The Death of John MacArthur

Wed, 06 Aug 2025 06:00:00 +0000

John MacArthur, longtime pastor of Grace Community Church in California, passed away on July 14, 2025. MacArthur preached in the same pulpit for 56 years. His recorded sermons and syndicated radio and television programs brought the gospel to people all over the world, and his writings impacted many more. On this episode, we discuss MacArthur’s legacy, the impact of his ministry, where we disagree with him, and the gaps his death leaves behind.

Chapters:

(0:00) Introductions: Patrick and Renee Got Us a Kringle!

(2:25) John MacArthur’s Obituary

(8:34) John’s Life and Ministry

(19:27) Where We Disagree with MacArthur (and Commend Him)

(25:38) Who Are the Next Generation of Stalwart Preachers?

Resources & Articles:

https://firstthings.com/a-straight-line-to-the-pulpit-the-legacy-of-john-macarthur/

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/15/us/john-macarthur-dead.html

Episode 532: From the Archives | Approaching the Lord’s Table

Wed, 30 Jul 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Communion should be a regular practice for all Christians—but there is freedom in how often and in what ways the church practices this historic sacrament. In this 2018 episode, we discuss how and why our churches observe communion the way we do.

Episode 531: The Untold Story of Prenatal Testing (Part 2)

Wed, 23 Jul 2025 06:00:00 +0000

In this episode, we hear a Christian doctor’s perspective on non-invasive prenatal testing (NIPT). He discusses the accuracy of the tests, explains what they are and aren't good for, and unpacks the challenges of practicing medicine as a Christian (especially in this specialty). We also ask our special guest Hannah what advice she would give to couples who are expecting children. Catch up on Part 1 of this conversation if you missed it.

Chapters:
(0:00) Introductions: More Insights from Hannah’s Journey
(4:30) Advice for Couples Who Are Expecting
(8:16) Bethany’s Experience with NIPT Testing
(14:26) A Christian Doctor’s Perspective on Prenatal Testing
(21:31) Final Thoughts on a Christian Approach to Prenatal Care

Resources & Articles:
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/01/upshot/pregnancy-birth-genetic-testing.html
https://wng.org/opinions/discrimination-down-to-a-science-1641556177
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cvgljz4vve2o
https://www.pew.org/en/research-and-analysis/articles/2022/09/06/inaccurate-prenatal-tests-can-harm-expectant-parents-but-stronger-oversight-can-help
https://time.com/7264271/ivf-pgta-test-lawsuit/

Episode 530: The Untold Story of Prenatal Testing (Part 1)

Wed, 16 Jul 2025 06:00:00 +0000

In recent years, pregnant moms have increasingly been offered NIPT (non-invasive prenatal testing) early in pregnancy. Silicon Valley startups are racing to cash in on the market for early-stage tests that can help identify genetic abnormalities and disorders. But it turns out that these tests are highly unreliable and often misleading. A New York Times investigation discovered that the five most common microdeletion tests (tests that look for chromosomal abnormalities) are incorrect 85% of the time. In this episode, a special guest (Hannah) shares her own troubling experience with faulty NIPT testing. Her story highlights the personal and ethical implications of this emerging aspect of prenatal medicine.

(0:00) Introductions: Might There Be Good BBQ in Omaha?
(3:36) A Basic Overview of Pre-Natal Testing
(9:27) Hannah Tells Her Story
(28:49) Spread The Word: Christian Couples Need to Know the Facts on NIPT

Episode 529: Summertime Pursuits

Wed, 25 Jun 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Summer is in full swing. We usually talk about big, weighty, theological and cultural topics on this podcast; but in the summertime, we take an episode or two to talk about what we're reading at the pool. In this episode, Bethany leads a conversation exploring the things we’re reading, watching, and thinking about this summer.

(0:00) Introductions: Summer Pursuits
(0:45) What We’re Reading
(10:28) Bob’s TGC Update
(15:40) What We’re Thinking About
(28:36) What We’re Watching (and Listening To)

Episode 528: Secularism Isn’t Working

Wed, 18 Jun 2025 06:00:00 +0000

In the early 2000s, New Atheism was all the rage. Many people left faith behind, convinced they didn't need religion. But it turns out society hasn’t been able to meaningfully replicate the benefits of church. In a recent New York Times article, Lauren Jackson describes how secularism sought to build transcendent community through means like yoga, CrossFit, SoulCycle, meditation and more. Despite these efforts, the data show that there is overwhelming empirical support for the value of being at a house of worship on a regular basis. In this episode, we discuss Jackson's article, and especially her poignant conclusion: "My spiritual longing hasn't been sated by secularism... I want a god."

(0:00) Introductions: Camille from Long Island’s Donut Drop
(2:00) Why America Is Revisiting Faith
(5:05) How Secularism Has Tried (and Failed) to Meet Our Needs
(16:57) Longing for “Inconvenient” Community
(22:31) Christian Community Provides the Meaning We Long For
(28:50) Be More Outgoing About What You Believe

Article: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/18/style/religion-america.html

Episode 527: Building a Classical Christian School

Wed, 11 Jun 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Last month, Trinity Classical Academy sent forth its first class of graduating seniors. To mark this milestone, we're republishing an interview that first aired in 2020 on Owen Strachan's now-defunct podcast. At that time, Dr. Strachan was on the faculty at Midwestern Baptist Theological Seminary, and he invited Bob Thune to MBTS's Spurgeon Library to talk about the founding of Trinity Classical Academy. The founding and building of institutions is critical for gospel renewal, for societal health, and for the preservation and propagation of Christian faith. The story of TCA's success—from a fledgling startup school to a thriving educational institution—should inspire Christians to be dreamers and builders and doers.

(0:00) Introductions: Bob Introduces Owen Introducing Bob
(4:33) The Origin Story of Trinity Classical Academy
(20:30) The Aim of Education: Formation
(27:13) How Can You be a Catalyst in Your Context?

Episode 526: The AI Debate, Part 2

Wed, 04 Jun 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Welcome back for part 2 of the AI Debate! Bob Thune and Jacob Tewes continue their friendly debate about the proposition: "Christians can and should use AI tools." This episode considers the downstream effects of AI, the faulty anthropology it assumes, the question of whether Christians should be "early adopters," and whether demonology should factor into the conversation. Catch up on Part 1 if you missed it.

(0:00) Introductions: Diving Right Back In
(4:41) AI Assumes an Unbiblical Anthropology
(8:12) Does AI Open Us Up to the Influence of Spiritual Beings?
(20:26) Is Healthy Skepticism Enough?
(35:21) What Should Christians Do with AI?

Episode 525: The AI Debate, Part 1

Wed, 28 May 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Special guest Jacob Tewes joins the podcast to engage Bob in a friendly debate about AI. The proposition: "Christians can and should use artificial intelligence." Bob argues the negative; Jacob, based on his background as an attorney for multiple AI-related startups, argues the affirmative. We talk education, innovation, Christian freedom, and the question of responsible use. Whether you're optimistic or skeptical about AI, this conversation will deepen your thinking about the ethics, implications, and limits of artificial intelligence. Catch the next episode for part 2 of the debate!

(0:00) Introductions: Jacob & Jacob Join The Podcast
(2:21) The Proposition
(9:58) Jacob: AI is a Tool Christians Should Use Wisely
(15:19) Bob: AI is Not a Neutral Tool
(19:51) Is Responsible Use of AI Possible?
(31:10) AI is a Bad Shortcut

Episode 524: Consumer Eugenics

Wed, 21 May 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Numerous Silicon Valley startups now offer parents the ability to test and screen embryos, identifying those at increased risk for various health problems. But while the marketing language seems helpful, the dark reality is that these companies promise to destroy human lives before they have time to grow. In this episode, we use an article from the American Enterprise Institute as a catalyst to begin a conversation about consumer eugenics. We explore how companies like Orchid Health weaponize parents’ fears and anxieties, and why Christians need to be ethically proactive and wise in evaluating reproductive technology.

(0:00) Introductions: Consumer Eugenics is Becoming a Big Thing
(1:39) Why Consumer Eugenics Is Not a Good Thing
(15:12) Understanding the Ethics & Language of Consumer Eugenics
(18;53) The Need for a Robust Anthropology
(24:58) Keeping Our Eyes Wide Open

Article: https://www.aei.org/op-eds/silicon-valleys-consumer-eugenics/

Episode 523: Why We’re Not Papists

Wed, 14 May 2025 06:00:00 +0000

The death of Pope Francis and subsequent election of Leo XIV has put the papal office at the forefront of cultural discourse. But how and when did Christians start to revere the bishop of Rome? Where did the Pope's authority and importance originate? And why did the Reformers strongly critique the papacy? In this episode, we discuss the development of the papacy in church history, the internal and external pushback against the Pope, and the importance of developing thoughtful, convictional Protestant sensibilities.

(0:00) Introductions: Why We’re Not Papists
(3:24) The Rise of the Pope in Church History
(11:07) Apologetic Arguments Against the Papacy
(24:47) Reading a Letter from Luther
(31:36) It's OK to Be a Convictional Protestant

Episode 522: The Quiet Revival

Wed, 07 May 2025 06:00:00 +0000

For decades, Christianity has been in decline in the UK. The common wisdom held that secularization was inevitable, and that the US would follow the same pattern. But a brand-new study shows a surprising trend. Over the last 6 years in England and Wales, church attendance has risen 50%. The largest increases are among young people – especially young men. And they're not just showing up to church, they're also reading the Bible and practicing spiritual disciplines. In this episode, we dig into what the Holy Spirit is doing across the pond and what it portends for the future of the church.

(0:00) Introductions: Katrina’s Last Snacks
(1:48) The Quiet Revival in the UK
(6:47) The Kids are Alright
(11:57) The Stats Say: Invite Your Friends to Church!
(16:54) Investing in the Kingdom of God

Study: https://www.biblesociety.org.uk/research/quiet-revival

Episode 521: From the Archives | Love, Know, Speak, Do

Wed, 30 Apr 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Everyone is in need of change. But how do Christians actually participate in the work of change? In this archive episode from 2018, we survey Paul Tripp’s book Instruments in the Redeemer’s Hands to discuss the simple biblical pattern for helping people change: love, know, speak, do.

Episode 520: The Death of a Seminary

Wed, 23 Apr 2025 06:00:00 +0000

A couple weeks ago, Trinity Evangelical Divinity School announced the impending closure of its Chicago-area campus. The demise of TEDS is the latest in a spate of struggles among Christian higher-ed institutions. Why are seminaries and colleges closing their doors? What does it mean for the future of theological education? In this episode, we dig into the history of 20th-century American Christianity to explore the founding of evangelical institutions, the challenges that brought them to this point, the "Southern takeover" of American evangelicalism, and what the future might hold.

(0:00) Introductions: Theological Education is Suffering
(5:00) What Happened at TEDS
(10:36) Some Broader Analysis & Bob's Historical Survey
(22:16) The Rise of the SBC
(32:29) What this Means for Christian Scholarship
(37:07) Opportunities for the Future

Episode 519: A.I. vs. Agency

Wed, 16 Apr 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Intelligence is everywhere. People used to say that "knowledge is power," but machine learning is changing everything. One author argues that we've moved from the Information Age to the Age of Agency. In this new era, your impact will be measured not by what you know, but by your ability to take action and make things happen. What changes might this new era require in education, discipleship, and spiritual formation? In this episode, we discuss how Christians can apply the wisdom of the Scriptures to this moment and spur one another to renewed agency.

(0:00) Introductions: We’re Talking A.I. Again
(3:10) The Rise of Agency
(10:31) 4 Eras of Human History
(16:07) You Can Just Do Things
(22:41) Wisdom vs. Knowledge
(24:56) Applying Wisdom to the Intelligence Age

Article: https://jeffgiesea.substack.com/p/agency-is-the-new-superpower

Episode 518: Catholicism in Decline

Wed, 09 Apr 2025 06:00:00 +0000

In our recent conversation about the recent Pew Religious Landscape Study, we missed an interesting data point: the decline of the Roman Catholic church. In this episode, we interact with a WORLD Opinion piece that explores the data and proposes some explanations for the downward trend. We discuss Catholic/Protestant apologetics; why high-profile "celebrity conversions" don't tell the whole story; and why discipling and catechizing our kids is vital to the growth and health of Christianity.

(0:00) Introductions
(1:19) Something We Missed from the Pew Religious Landscape Study
(13:38) What the Decline of Catholicism Means for Culture At Large
(16:14) Opportunities for Charitable Conversations Among Protestants and Catholics
(24:17) The Importance of Discipling and Catechizing Our Children

Article: https://wng.org/opinions/mass-exodus-1743031983

Research Study: https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2025/02/26/decline-of-christianity-in-the-us-has-slowed-may-have-leveled-off/

Episode 517: The Decline of the Metaverse

Wed, 02 Apr 2025 06:00:00 +0000

In 2021, Mark Zuckerberg changed his company's name from Facebook to Meta. It signaled his decision to go "all in" on virtual reality and everything it promised. (We talked about it in Episode 366: Meta Church.) But less than four years later, the meta-hype is collapsing, with every major VR company reporting losses and pulling back products. In this episode, we discuss what we can learn from the meteoric rise and decline of virtual reality... and how this tale can make us wiser in our approach to technology.

(0:00) Introductions and a Quick Trip into the Archives
(2:56) Virtual Reality Gets a Reality Check
(8:22) Humans Actually Like Embodied-ness
(17:28) Knowing How Technology Shapes Us

Article: https://wng.org/articles/a-dose-of-reality-1738632435

Episode 516: Physical Fitness

Wed, 26 Mar 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Modern people spend lots of time, energy, and money on their bodies - whether it be through diet and supplements or working out and exercise. Some become so focused on exercise and nutrition that they idolize their bodies while others are prone to neglect their physical bodies. In this episode, we respond to a listener-submitted question about the role of physical fitness in the life of the Christian. How does the fact that we're going to die (Psalm 90:10) inform a Christian approach to fitness? How can we avoid idolizing or neglecting our physical health? Listen in as we discuss the wisdom Scripture provides in this area.

(0:00) Introductions and Talking Physical Fitness
(5:50) Grounding the Conversation in Scripture
(9:23) What Role Does Physical Fitness Play in the Life of a Christian?
(19:08) How Do I Know I’m Glorifying God with My Body?
(27:06) Stewarding All of Our Resources Well

Episode 515: The Decline of the Decline of Christianity

Wed, 19 Mar 2025 06:00:00 +0000

Much has been said and written about the decline of Christianity in America, including on this podcast. But is something changing? A new Pew Research Center study shows that the decline of Christianity has tapered off over the past few years. In this episode, we dig into the statistics and analyze the opportunities they present for Christians to be on mission.

(0:00) Introductions
(1:05) The Data Shows…De-Churching Is Leveling Off
(7:50) Some of Our Favorite Research Study Nuggets
(12:13) How to Make Sense of This as Church Leaders
(24:10) The ONE Thing We Want You to Take with You

Article: https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2025/02/26/decline-of-christianity-in-the-us-has-slowed-may-have-leveled-off/

Episode 514: Christians Reading Romantasy?

Wed, 12 Mar 2025 06:00:00 +0000

On January 10th of this year, book lovers lined up to purchase the newest release in the Empyrean series by Rebecca Yarros. These books are part of a genre known as romantic fantasy, or "romantasy" - and its popularity is exploding. But how should Christian women relate to romantasy literature? Recently, a church member reached out to us with some unease about how nonchalantly her Christian friends were imbibing the explicit sexual imagery in these novels. So we invited her to come on the podcast and talk about it! In this episode, Adrienne joins us to discuss the rise of romantasy, the ways that it can steer us away from a godly view of sex and intimacy, and how Christians can better commend what is good, true and beautiful.

(0:00) Introductions: Guess Who’s Baaaaaack??
(2:15) The Rise of Romantasy and What Makes it Problematic
(11:27) Two Main Romantasy Markets
(15:50) Why Escapism is a Powerful Temptation
(19:29) What Does it Mean to Engage Culture?
(32:38) How to Commend Good Art

Article: https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/christians-need-know-romantasy/

Episode 513: Four Tribes on the Political Right

Wed, 05 Mar 2025 07:00:00 +0000

How can we make sense of right-leaning politics in the wake of the 2024 election? Is a second Trump presidency the result of populism? Nationalism? Techno-oligarchy? Something else? Recently, Jake Meador identified four distinct "tribes" on the political right that share some common aims but differ widely in their approaches. Whatever your personal politics, you're going to be living with these tribes for the next few years - so you might as well get to know them. In this episode, we interact with Meador's essay and explore its implications for Christian faithfulness.

(0:00) Introduction and Stories
(5:43) The Four Tribes on the Political Right, Explained
(24:31) How Christian Civic Republicanism Differs from Classical Liberalism
(27:02) The Importance of Freedom of Conscience
(30:40) A Case Study on Christian Nationalism
(35:50) Christianity and the Common Good

Article: https://mereorthodoxy.com/after-progressive-neo-liberalism

Episode 512: Right-Wing Exvangelicals

Wed, 26 Feb 2025 07:00:00 +0000

Over the past decade, leaving the church has been a trend - and the leavers have been mostly left-leaning. But Jake Meador identifies a more recent trend of "right-wing exvangelicals." Whereas the left-wing exvangelicals liked Jesus but weren't sure about the church, right-wing exvangelicals want to keep civic religion but aren't as interested in the way of Jesus. In this episode, we talk about these trends, how we're seeing them in our churches, and how the gospel speaks to them.

(0:00) Introductions & Snack Shout-outs
(2:49) What is an Ex-vangelical? Definition & History
(9:54) The Growing Trend of Right-Wing Exvangelicals
(13:00) Politics as a Replacement Religion
(18:07) Keeping the Main Thing the Main Thing
(30:34) C.S. Lewis: Beware of “Christianity And"

Article: https://mereorthodoxy.com/two-types-of-exvangelicals

Episode 511: Angels, Demons, and AI

Wed, 19 Feb 2025 07:00:00 +0000

Artificial Intelligence is generating a lot of interest these days. President Trump even issued an executive order to "sustain and enhance America’s global AI dominance." So how should Christians think about AI? Can a machine even be "intelligent?" How does Christian theology help us go beyond the hype to engage the substance of the debate? In this episode, we draw on the wisdom of Thomas Aquinas to discuss the nature the mind, the intelligence of angels and demons, and how the Christian tradition helps us evaluate and assess technological progress.

Article: https://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2025/01/96910/

Episode 510: The Anti-Social Century

Wed, 12 Feb 2025 07:00:00 +0000

In a recent article for The Atlantic, Derek Thompson writes about the surge in Americans eating alone, shopping alone, and generally doing life alone. In this episode, we discuss his analysis of the problem, talk about the wisdom the church can offer, and explore how the Christian tradition promotes both community and solitude.

Article (requires subscription): https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2025/02/american-loneliness-personality-politics/681091/

Episode 509: Revival in Silicon Valley?

Wed, 05 Feb 2025 07:00:00 +0000

There's a bit of a "vibe shift" underway in American culture, and Silicon Valley is one place where it's evident. Recently, a listener passed along an article about the renewed interest in Christianity among tech and venture-capital elites. In this episode, we explore how the spiritual hunger in Silicon Valley relates to a larger cultural trend, and the opportunities it provides for Christians to show the beauty and goodness of the Christian story.

Article (requires subscription): https://www.theinformation.com/articles/the-antichrist-and-the-new-apostles

Episode 508: From the Archives | The Law and the Gospel

Wed, 29 Jan 2025 07:00:00 +0000

God reveals his grace to us through both law and gospel. In this episode from 2016, we talk about how the law and the gospel fit together.

Episode 507: The Book of Daniel

Wed, 22 Jan 2025 07:00:00 +0000

Daniel in the lion's den. Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego in the fiery furnace. The handwriting on the wall. These beloved stories are found in the book of Daniel. But Daniel also contains some strange prophecies, some troubling dreams, and some confusing apocalyptic imagery. In this episode, we discuss how this fascinating book of the Bible captures the sweep of the whole biblical story. We explore the date of Daniel, its textual tradition, its place in Jewish apocalyptic literature, and what it tells us about faithful living in exile.

Episode 506: What is Post-Liberalism?

Wed, 15 Jan 2025 07:00:00 +0000

In recent decades, liberalism—the political philosophy that undergirds Western democracy—has come under increasing scrutiny. Though it purports to emphasize freedom, independence, and self-determination, it has created a crisis of meaning and an erosion of norms. In this episode, we analyze a new "post-liberal manifesto" that points out the problems with liberalism, imagines what might take its place, and explores how Christians can offer a new vision of the common good.

Episode 505: The Age of Hitler

Wed, 08 Jan 2025 07:00:00 +0000

World War II has become the dominant story of the 20th century. Just think about all the films it's inspired: Schindler's List, Saving Private Ryan, Dunkirk, Inglorious Basterds, Oppenheimer, and hundreds more. But a recent article from Dr. Alec Ryrie poses the question: what happens to Western culture when we pivot from a positive moral exemplar (Jesus) to a negative one (Hitler)? In this episode, we engage Ryrie's article, unpacking the moral shift in our culture and exploring its implications.

Episode 504: 2024 in Review

Wed, 11 Dec 2024 07:00:00 +0000

As a new year approaches, we look back on the year that's ending. We discuss some of the newsworthy & notable events of 2024, some of the things that brought us a deeper sense of worship, and some things we’re excited about as we anticipate 2025. Have a great holiday season, and we'll see you next year!

Episode 503: A Conversation with James Martin

Wed, 04 Dec 2024 07:00:00 +0000

In this episode, Bob interviews James Martin, Lead Pastor of Bradfield & Rougham Baptist Church in Suffolk, England. They discuss James’ story, the joys and struggles of pastoring in rural England, and his hope for gospel renewal in the UK and Europe.

Episode 502: Anthropomorphic Language in Genesis

Wed, 27 Nov 2024 07:00:00 +0000

“And the LORD regretted that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him to his heart” (Genesis 6:5-6). When we see this kind of language in the Bible, how should we interpret it? In this episode, we discuss the function of anthropomorphic language in Scripture. We consider how it helps us to understand God, but also how it can lead to error if we minimize the Creator-creature distinction.

Episode 501: Genesis vs. Gilgamesh

Wed, 20 Nov 2024 07:00:00 +0000

The book of Genesis tells us how everything came into being. But other creation narratives existed in the Ancient Near East. Does that mean each culture's creation story is just a relativistic myth? In this episode, we compare the Genesis account with the Epic of Gilgamesh, revealing the surprising uniqueness of the biblical story.

EPISODE 500

Wed, 13 Nov 2024 07:00:00 +0000

Thanks for listening over the past 10 years! On this episode, we welcome back Mike and Bethany to reflect on some of our favorite moments, remember our favorite guests, and express our gratitude for the ways God has graced us through the Wednesday Conversation. (Thanks also to half a dozen different listeners who provided commemorative snacks to mark this milestone!)

Episode 499: Election Results and Analysis

Wed, 06 Nov 2024 13:33:46 +0000

In the freshest episode of the podcast ever recorded, Bob, Dusty, and Chris turn on the mics at 5:30am to offer their real-time responses to the 2024 election.

Episode 498: The Long Lifespans in Genesis

Wed, 23 Oct 2024 06:00:00 +0000

“When Adam had lived 130 years, he fathered a son in his own likeness…The days of Adam after he fathered Seth were 800 years” (Genesis 5:3–4). When we come across these massive human lifespans in the book of Genesis, how are we to make sense of them? In this episode, we discuss the literary function of numbers, the symbolic significance of numbers in the Ancient Near East, and the importance of attentive reading as we grow in our love for the Scriptures.

Episode 497: Who are the Nephilim?

Wed, 16 Oct 2024 06:00:00 +0000

“The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them” (Genesis 6:4). Texts like Genesis 6 raise profound questions and don’t always offer easy explanations. In this episode, we discuss the perplexing topic of the Nephilim. Exploring some of the intertextual connections in Scripture, we survey the historical interpretations and try to shed some light on this strange episode in the Genesis narrative.

Episode 496: Who is the Serpent?

Wed, 09 Oct 2024 06:00:00 +0000

"Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God had made" (Genesis 3:1). Why does this talking serpent suddenly appear in the Genesis narrative? Drawing inspiration from Michael Heiser’s book The Unseen Realm, we dig into how ancient readers understood the concept of spiritual beings, how those beings are described in later passages of Scripture, and how these insights help us become more imaginative readers of the biblical story.

Episode 495: Was the Flood Universal or Local?

Wed, 02 Oct 2024 06:00:00 +0000

"I will bring a flood of waters upon the earth to destroy all flesh... Everything that is on the earth shall die," God says in Genesis 6:17. So was Noah's flood a global deluge that covered the entire earth? Or was it a regional event? By even asking this question, are we playing fast and loose with the text? In this episode we take up some of the questions surrounding the flood narrative in Genesis 6-9.

Episode 494: Can We Still Believe in Adam and Eve?

Wed, 25 Sep 2024 06:00:00 +0000

The veracity and historicity of Genesis is taken for granted by the New Testament authors and by Jesus himself. Yet many modern Christians feel the tension of holding a high view of Genesis while also weighing the claims of modern science. In this episode, we respond to a listener's question about how to properly read Genesis, taking into account the claims of geology, archaeology, and genetic science. Can we still believe in a historical Adam and Eve? Or are they merely legendary characters in a mythical story?

Episode 493: Let’s Talk Genesis 2

Wed, 18 Sep 2024 06:00:00 +0000

After creating the heavens and the earth, God rests. The principle of Sabbath becomes a major theme throughout the rest of Scripture. Aaron Mattox joins us to discuss how this theme of Sabbath-rest is emphasized and developed within the biblical storyline, and what it means for us today.

Episode 492: What God’s Up To In Kathmandu

Wed, 11 Sep 2024 13:28:05 +0000

Dusty’s back, everyone! Also Chris returned from his trip to Nepal. In this episode, Chris shares some highlights from his trip, including some updates on the growth and health of the church in Kathmandu.

Episode 491: Let’s Talk Genesis 1

Wed, 04 Sep 2024 06:00:00 +0000

Genesis is an intriguing book, and a complicated one. It forms the prelude to the entire biblical narrative. In this episode, Aaron Mattox joins us to discuss some of the particulars of Genesis 1, and how we can grow as good and faithful Bible readers.

Episode 490: Bob Wrote a Book

Wed, 28 Aug 2024 06:00:00 +0000

It's book release week! Bob's latest book Gospel Training for Deacons hit the shelves on August 27. We thought it would be a good time to discuss the book and respond to a listener's question about how Bob approaches the writing process and what he emphasizes as he writes.

Episode 489: The Difference Between Sin & Immaturity

Wed, 21 Aug 2024 06:00:00 +0000

How should we understand the difference between sin and immaturity? To put it simply: one is moral/ethical and the other is not. In this episode, we parse out how to identify spiritual, emotional, or relational immaturity. We also explore how the gospel helps us grow out of immaturity into deeper wisdom.

Episode 488: Cathedrals

Wed, 14 Aug 2024 06:00:00 +0000

Cathedrals have long captured the imagination of human beings. But why? What is it about these sacred spaces that evokes a sense of wonder and beauty? On his recent vacation, Chris visited several cathedrals in Spain; upon his return, we discuss the importance of developing a Christian aesthetic and how it can lead us to a deeper worship of God.

Episode 487: TWC Commentary | The Shift in Pro-Life Politics

Wed, 07 Aug 2024 06:00:00 +0000

Christians are a pro-life people. In the past, the pro-life strategy was fairly straightforward: help pregnant moms and work toward the repeal of Roe v. Wade. But the Dobbs Decision in 2022 brought about a shift in legislative strategy and tactics. In this episode, Bob uses Rusty Reno's categories of principle and prudence to discuss political platforms, state-level ballot initiatives, and how Christians can work together with grace and charity.

Article: https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2024/07/the-republican-party-sidelines-the-pro-life-cause

Episode 486: From the Archives | Typology in the Bible

Wed, 31 Jul 2024 06:00:00 +0000

The whole Old Testament points beyond itself for fulfillment and anticipates the coming of Jesus Christ. In this episode from 2017, we discuss how understanding typology can enrich our reading of the Bible and sharpen our theological clarity.

Episode 485: TWC Commentary | The New Populism Is Here to Stay

Wed, 24 Jul 2024 06:00:00 +0000

It’s an election year, friends! And newsworthy events in American politics are taking place almost every day. Recently, Donald Trump decided to make JD Vance his running mate. That choice marks a new moment in American politics: it signifies that populism is here to stay. In this episode, Bob unpacks some insights from political scientist Damon Linker about how this new populism differs from traditional conservatism, what it means for the Republican and Democratic parties, and how Christians should think about their political identity.

Article: https://damonlinker.substack.com/p/the-convert

Episode 484: The Sins That We Don’t See

Wed, 17 Jul 2024 06:00:00 +0000

What does gospel renewal look like as Christians mature in their walk with the Lord? Drawing from the work of Tim Keller and John Newton, we look at how even our strengths and virtues have a "shadow side" that leads to selfishness and sin. We talk about how we can humbly acknowledge these “small faults" and cultivate the fruit of the Spirit more fully in our lives.

Article: https://quarterly.gospelinlife.com/wisdom-of-john-newton/

Episode 483: Does Christian Love Require Open Borders?

Wed, 10 Jul 2024 06:00:00 +0000

In an article for First Things, Brad Littlejohn uses traditional Christian moral theology to tackle the issues of immigration and national borders. In this episode, we summarize Littlejohn’s arguments, how the analogy of a house and home helps create distinctions, and how governments and Christians are called to act with wise judgment and prudence within our finitude and limitations.

Article: https://www.firstthings.com/article/2024/06/theology-of-immigration

Episode 482: TWC Commentary | When You Shouldn’t Trust “The Science”

Wed, 19 Jun 2024 06:00:00 +0000

Wiley and Sons, the largest publisher of scientific journals in the world, announced that they had found over 8,000 junk papers—papers written by artificial intelligence but attached to the name of a researcher—and were pausing publications of several scientific journals. Bob takes some time to unpack the implications of this and what happens when we make “The Science” the ultimate authority.

Episode 481: The Omnicause

Wed, 12 Jun 2024 11:00:00 +0000

In a recent article, Mary Harrington uses the term “omnicause” to describe how progressivism opposes whatever is considered mainstream, institutional, or Western. In this episode, we discuss where Harrington’s analysis has validity, where we might disagree, and how Christians can practice good cultural apologetics in this moment.

Episode 480: TWC Commentary | What Did Harrison Butker Say?

Wed, 05 Jun 2024 12:30:00 +0000

Harrison Butker, the placekicker for the Kansas City Chiefs, has received a lot of ire from media outlets following a speech he made at the commencement of Benedictine College. In this episode, Bob breaks down the context in which his speech was given, what Butker said and didn’t say, and what it looks like for Christians to live with courageous convictions in their vocations.

Speech Transcript: https://www.ncregister.com/news/harrison-butker-speech-at-benedictine

Episode 479: From the Archives | The Three Phases of Discipleship

Wed, 29 May 2024 12:30:00 +0000

What does discipleship to Jesus look like over the course of your life? And how does that change as you move into different seasons of life? In 2018, we used Ronald Rolheiser’s book “Sacred Fire” to discuss the three phases of discipleship and how that helps us to frame discipleship in the local church.

Episode 478: Making Faith Magnetic

Wed, 22 May 2024 06:00:00 +0000

How can we have meaningful evangelistic conversations with our non-Christian friends and family? In his book “Making Faith Magnetic,” Dr. Dan Strange develops the work of J.H. Bavinck, proposing 5 "magnetic points" that are present within every human and every culture. In this episode, we analyze these magnetic points, explore their "subversive fulfillment" in Jesus, and consider how they can be useful in talking about faith.

Book Link: https://www.thegoodbook.com/making-faith-magnetic

Episode 477: Takeaways from the Keller Center

Wed, 15 May 2024 06:00:00 +0000

After gathering in NYC with the other fellows of The Keller Center for Cultural Apologetics, Bob shares some insights he gained and lessons he learned. He also discusses some of the ways the fellows are seeking to apply the intellectual work of the Keller Center to the practices of the local church.

Episode 476: The Need for Competence

Wed, 08 May 2024 06:00:00 +0000

Human beings have an inherent desire to be good at something. But becoming competent requires self-awareness and humility. In this episode, we lay the groundwork for how the gospel frees us to admit our strengths & weaknesses, discover our aptitudes, and grow in competence.

Episode 475: From the Archives | Taking Church Membership Seriously

Wed, 01 May 2024 06:00:00 +0000

Why does church membership matter? In this episode from 2016, we discuss the importance of being committed to the local church.

Episode 474: An Interview with Johan Verster | Part 2

Wed, 24 Apr 2024 06:00:00 +0000

This episode continues Bob's conversation with special guest Johan Verster, exploring the particulars of Ligpunt Church and the context of growing and planting churches in South Africa.

Episode 473: An Interview with Johan Verster | Part 1

Wed, 17 Apr 2024 06:00:00 +0000

Bob sat down with Pastor Johan Verster during his time in the United States to talk about his story, his journey to faith, and how he came to plant Ligpunt Church in Pretoria, South Africa.

Episode 472: From the Archives | Four Views of Communion

Wed, 10 Apr 2024 06:00:00 +0000

It’s easy for the sacrament of communion to become commonplace, and it can be tempting for Christians to participate mindlessly. Many Christians may not know the answers to questions like, “What is communion?” and “Why do we observe it regularly?” In 2019, we decided to spend some time discussing the sacrament of communion - the four main views surrounding it and how we choose to practice it in our local churches.

Episode 471: Where the Trans Conversation is Headed

Wed, 03 Apr 2024 06:00:00 +0000

In a recent article for New York Magazine, Andrea Long Chu asserts the belief that kids should have the freedom to change their bodies and sexual identity at any time for any reason. In this episode, we discuss what that means for the direction of culture and society, and how Christians can courageously and faithfully uphold the traditional sexual ethic.

Episode 470: The Resurrection As History

Wed, 27 Mar 2024 06:00:00 +0000

For much of the 20th century, the resurrection of Jesus was believed by Christians as a matter of faith, but doubted by scholars as a matter of history. NT Wright’s book “The Resurrection of the Son of God” changed all that. In this episode, we survey Wright’s major argument for the historicity of the resurrection, and explore how his work can help us interact with skeptics.

Episode 469: How to Feel

Wed, 20 Mar 2024 06:00:00 +0000

As image-bearers of God, we are made to feel. Yet we can have a limited emotional range or lack the ability to tap into what we’re feeling in a given moment. In this episode, we discuss why emotional awareness is important and how it leads to a deeper, more honest relationship with the Lord and one another.

Episode 468: The Negative World (Again)

Wed, 13 Mar 2024 06:00:00 +0000

Aaron Renn’s new book “Life in the Negative World” uses the experience of The Crossing Church as an example of what happens when a church tries to minister faithfully in a "negative world." Patrick Miller, pastor of The Crossing, wrote an article to tell the fuller story of their church's partnership with a progressive film festival. In this episode, we dissect Miller’s essay and discuss where Renn’s hypothesis is helpful and where it falls short.

Article: https://mereorthodoxy.com/the-crossing-negative-world

Episode 467: Reflections on the Evangelical Fracturing

Wed, 06 Mar 2024 07:00:00 +0000

2014 was the year American evangelical Christianity began to fracture. In today’s episode, we reflect on a Jake Meador article that uses the Acts 29 Network as a case study exploring that fracturing. Based on our own experiences during that time, we analyze where Meador's analysis rings true and where it doesn't.

Article: https://mereorthodoxy.com/ten-years-evangelical-fracturing

Episode 466: The Stories We Could Tell...

Wed, 28 Feb 2024 07:00:00 +0000

In ministry work, pastors often have rich, joyful, redemptive stories to tell. And there are also some odd stories. The ones that make you ask, “Did that really happen?” From being interrupted while preaching a sermon to being asked to fly across the country to approve of a relationship: in today’s episode, we recount some of the most interesting experiences we've had in pastoral ministry.

Episode 465: Evaluating “Gentle Parenting”

Wed, 21 Feb 2024 07:00:00 +0000

“Gentle parenting” is the latest parenting trend, and parents are increasingly being exposed to it as it gains popularity through social media. In this episode, we discuss what the gentle parenting approach entails, and how Scripture evaluates this method of child-rearing.

Article: https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/gentle-parenting-biblical/

Episode 464: Should Christians Observe Lent?

Wed, 14 Feb 2024 07:00:00 +0000

Many Christians observe Lent. Others criticize the practice, claiming that Lent is "too Catholic." In this episode, we explore the history of Lent and discuss why it can be a very meaningful season for Christians. We also disagree with one another on some of the particulars of Lenten worship.

Episode 463: Who Is My Neighbor?

Wed, 07 Feb 2024 07:00:00 +0000

How do we apply the Good Samaritan parable in a world where we’re constantly exposed to the needs of others? Do we have the same moral obligation to those across the world as we have to those closest to us? Prompted by a recent inquiry from a listener, we discuss the ever-provocative question: who is my neighbor?

Episode 462: From the Archives | The Gospel and Shame

Wed, 31 Jan 2024 07:00:00 +0000

Almost 10 years ago, we sat down with Dr. Gary Nebeker to talk about shame and its impact on the soul. Because shame can hinder us from experiencing the joy and freedom of the gospel, it's important that we attend to its presence and engage it in light of the gospel.