On the Other Hand

# 99, OTOH, Glen, April, & Jerry Henderson provide update on polarization research and solutions, Part 5 of 5, Feb 6 2025

Sat, 29 Mar 2025 14:12:23 -0500

For this 5th and final part of our update on political polarization research and thinking, Glen begins with his thoughts on solutions for political polarization related problems, which include research on societal characteristics that are associated with peaceful societies. For the remainder of this final episode, we all discuss several other ideas, which include contact theory, and other positive practices. We then conclude our discussion with some thoughts on how we might best proceed in our society’s political conversations so that we retain a healthy, functioning democracy and society.

# 98, OTOH, Glen, April, & Jerry Henderson provide update on polarization research and solutions, Part 4 of 5, Feb 6 2025

Sun, 23 Mar 2025 04:14:23 -0500

In part 4 of our 5 episodes devoted to updates on polarization research and related topics, Glen and April provide specific information that they chose as important in understanding and dealing with various polarization related issues. Glen begins by describing how various behaviors in society are enabled by powerful effects of social modeling, then he focuses on mis- & disinformation as a growing and malevolent influence on polarization. Glen offers suggestions for how we might address this increasing problem of erroneous information in our digitally influenced society. Suggestions include the importance of education that helps us all improve our media literacy, as well as the importance of building community. April encourages continued respect toward those who may be inadvertently spreading bad information and to continue to engage with others, even when some of their ideas are uncomfortable for us. Jerry points out how compassion and mindfulness practices can serve as a healing alternative to excessive reliance on either emotion or reason. April then discusses various types of civility and how they can be either more or less helpful in dealing with conflict. We conclude this round with a more in-depth discussion of the key points covered. Next up will be our 5th and final episode in this series on polarization research and thinking.

#97, OTOH, Glen, April, & Jerry Henderson provide update on polarization research and solutions, Part 3 of 5, Feb 6 2025

Sun, 16 Mar 2025 22:43:27 -0500

In this 3rd of 5 episodes for our polarization research update, our guest Jerry Henderson starts by providing information on current thinking in Evolutionary Psychology and on origins of tribalism as a powerful force. Jerry describes how this all relates to understanding polarization and why we are prone to many of the behaviors and problems we currently see in our society related to political differences and conflict. Glen points out how the age of Enlightenment and its new focus on reason, while largely a positive development in civilized society, failed to understand the huge role played by emotion, intuition and other unconscious processes in how we believe and behave. April then discusses potential imitations in relying excessively upon rationality and the importance of utilizing effectively the emotions and intuitions that influence us. We continue to vigorously discuss our thoughts regarding the new information covered.

# 96, OTOH, Glen, April, & Jerry Henderson provide update on polarization research and solutions, Part 2 of 5, Feb 6 2025

Sat, 15 Mar 2025 02:35:23 -0500

For part 2 of our polarization research update, Jerry and Glen present their thoughts on topic 1 (Why is it important to understand political polarization?), after which April, Glen and Jerry all discuss the new information from Glen and Jerry. Discussion points include the impact of polarization on societal health, both of individuals and of democracy itself; Influences from media and the digital environment; and role of social norms in how we respond to polarization.

In part 3 next, we’ll begin having each of us present information on a topic of our choice that relates to the overall intent of providing an update to the latest research and thinking about political polarization and related issues.

# 95, OTOH, Glen, April, & Jerry Henderson provide update on polarization research and solutions, Part 1, Feb 6 2025

Sun, 09 Mar 2025 17:08:12 -0500

For this first of 5 parts of an extended conversation, Glen and April welcome a returning guest, Dr. Jerry Henderson, a retired psychologist. In 2022, Glen and Jerry discussed some key research findings and expert opinions on political polarization, formation of beliefs in humans, and related topics. In this new 5-part series, the three of us are updating information in this rich field of study, as we each provide some of our highlights from the latest research and thinking on political polarization and related topics. After we provide a brief introduction to the structure of the series, we each briefly describe our credentials and other work that establishes our credibility in providing this information. We then begin to provide our thoughts on topic 1: Why is it important to understand political polarization? April starts with some basic definitions and questions for how we can assess our own degree of polarization. Next, we all engage in discussion about the information April provided.

In the next episode, part 2 in this series, Jerry and Glen will present their thoughts on the importance of understanding polarization, after which we engage in discussion about the newly presented information.

#94 OTOH, Anthony Taylor, Catholic Bishop of Little Rock, Part 2, Feb 5 2025

Sat, 01 Mar 2025 17:21:04 -0600

In this second part of our conversation with Little Rock Catholic Bishop Anthony Taylor, Glen and April explore with him how he deals with polarized congregations and other potentially difficult conversations with groups or individuals. One intriguing guideline he suggests following in such situations is to "will the good," an approach he explains in terms of religious and personal strategies. Anthony also provides insight into his views on navigating potential conflicts between religion and government, science, non-believers, and others. He also describes his thinking on dealing with religious extremists of various faiths, including those within Christianity. He ends with a story about the highly unusual circumstances of his entry into school as a first grader.

#93 OTOH, Anthony Taylor, Catholic Bishop of Little Rock, Part 1, Feb 5 2025

Mon, 24 Feb 2025 09:02:17 -0600

April and Glen welcome the Bishop of the Little Rock Catholic Church, Anthony Taylor, on our podcast. In this first part of our conversation with Bishop Taylor, he provides us with insight into early influences on his religious and moral values, which include a family history of persecution during the holocaust. Anthony also draws a distinction between the laws of government and religion, the latter of which he describes as a "higher law." Anthony's explanations of how Catholic teachings and traditions emphasize the common good are explored in several specific examples from the Catholic faith. He also highlights his long history of working with the Hispanic community, as well as his and the church's views of immigration as a human right.

#92 OTOH, Kate Tandy, Bridge USA founder at UA, part 2, 1-31-25

Mon, 17 Feb 2025 08:36:50 -0600

In the second part of our conversation with UA student and founder of the local Bridge USA chapter at the university, Kate Tandy speaks with April and Glen about various barriers encountered by her fellow students, including some surprising difficulties that reflect the dramatic changes in communication that pose challenges for young people only familiar with the current, largely digitized communication system in our country. Kate shares some of the issues that she sees as energizing young adults politically, as well as her choice to have hope for the future, despite several discouraging elements currently facing her generation and the country.

#91 OTOH, Kate Tandy, Bridge USA founder at UA, part 1, 1-31-25

Mon, 10 Feb 2025 19:35:40 -0600

#91 OTOH, Kate Tandy, Bridge USA founder at UA, part 1, 1-31-25

Glen and April welcome University of Arkansas student Kate Tandy, who founded the UA Fayetteville branch of Bridge USA, a national organization of college students who are working to build bridges across the political divide with youth in higher education settings. In this first part of our conversation, we hear about how Kate came to have a strong interest in politics and how she eventually acted to form a chapter of Bridge USA in her university setting. Among the matters we discuss in this part of the interview, we learn how Kate came to her current political views, which differ significantly from those with which she was familiar growing up in her family. She also describes her values that help her maintain close, positive relationships with family members and others, even when significant political differences are present. She then begins with us an exploration of possible generational differences she sees as relevant in understanding the divisions in our society.

#90, OTOH, Preston Clegg, Pastor of 2nd Baptist in Little Rock, Part 3, Dec 9, 2024

Tue, 28 Jan 2025 08:34:27 -0600

In this final, 3rd part of our interview with Preston Clegg, Pastor of 2nd Baptist in Little Rock, Glen and April learn more about Preston’s views regarding the importance of living and talking about a positive alternative to the negatives he sees in society. Using key points from author Parker Palmer, Preston talks about the need for more public spaces and opportunities for citizens in our society, even allowing that “more pubs” could be one part of that expansion of public opportunities. Continuing his emphasis on living Jesus’ Great Commandments, Preston provides advice that he also as consistent with Braver Angels’ approach to addressing political polarization, stating: "we can't speak the truth to people who we don't love" and "If we don't learn to love sinners, we'll find it hard to find anyone to love." Preston would most like to be remembered in a manner consistent with what Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. advocated based on the parable of the Good Samaritan: not merely helping folks on the side of the road who are in need, but also tending to the road and what about that road led to so many roadside casualties. We conclude our interview with a personal story he tells about how a Black pastor he once spoke with changed his life and his world view in 45 seconds.

#89, OTOH, Preston Clegg, Pastor of 2nd Baptist in Little Rock, Part 2, Dec 9, 2024

Sun, 19 Jan 2025 15:18:45 -0600

In this second of three episodes, April and Glen talk further with Preston Clegg, Pastor of 2nd Baptist in Little Rock. Preston goes into some detail about his concerns with Christian nationalism and the negative impact associated with this view. He sees significant inconsistencies with what he feels the Cristian message calls us to do, and he describes several of those concerns. Preston explores the potential for negative impact of following that extreme and distorted version of Christianity on our culture and politics. In a broader way, he sees all of us as being constantly “catechized” or influenced in society through our culture. Such an environment makes it tough to change peoples' views solely through a couple of weekly visits to church. One key approach to countering that potentially negative or misguided influence is for each of us to focus on and practice “the good,” modeling a positive alternative to the negative elements in our society.

#88, OTOH, Preston Clegg, Pastor of 2nd Baptist in Little Rock, Part 1, Dec 9, 2024

Mon, 13 Jan 2025 15:52:22 -0600

In this first of 3 parts of our interview with Dr. Preston Clegg, pastor of the 2nd Baptist church in Little Rock, Glen and April explore with Preston his life experiences, values, and his active work in the community. Preston is an active advocate for racial justice and for loving treatment of all members of the community, especially those who are vulnerable. Because of the values that he sees as essential to the Christian faith, Preston describes his ministry as "to summon people to higher ground." Preston also explains how his congregation is not part of the more widely recognized Southern Baptist branch but rather is affiliated with the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship. Using the Christian great commandments as his inspiration, Preston traces how this requirement of radical love led to his current political views. An important observation for Preston is how too many in Christianity these days are becoming "entangled" rather than engaged in the world, which can cause difficulty in lovingly speaking out on political matters. As a result, he strongly advocates an appropriate separation of church and state and in speaking truth to those in power.

#87, OTOH, Joni Lee, Vice Chancellor for University Affairs & Chief Government Relations Officer, at UA Little Rock, Part 2, Dec 5, 2024

Thu, 26 Dec 2024 11:25:05 -0600

April and Glen continue their conversation with Joni Lee, Vice Chancellor for University Affairs & Chief Government Relations Officer for the University of Arkansas at Little Rock, in this second part of their interview with Joni. April and Glen hear how Joni emphasizes relationships in her work, though her efforts have recently become more difficult, as many in government have become more motivated by tribal or party considerations in their decision-making and sometimes seem less amenable to respectful and open discussions. The current difficulties of finding compromise on many issues are worsened by partisan or external threats, which may lead them to vote counter to their values or beliefs. In some ways, she sees political struggles as having moved from a win/lose to a life/death perception in their intensity. Nevertheless, working in a political arena requires respect for the influence of power. Joni describes her ways of coping and persevering in her efforts, which include her faith, a willingness to listen, and a commitment to civility and respect. Joni offers advice for avoiding polarizing behavior in interactions with others, as well as offering suggestions for how citizens can become involved in positive ways that make a contribution to society. Finally, Joni recounts her family’s joking about her frequent visits to “old stuff” when viewing historic sites in DC. Those visits, however, help her to maintain hope in the resilience of our American system, which has experienced many prior struggles, yet continues to survive.

#86, OTOH, Joni Lee, Vice Chancellor for University Affairs & Chief Government Relations Officer, at UA Little Rock, Part 1, Dec 5, 2024

Thu, 26 Dec 2024 11:23:37 -0600

In the first part of our conversation with Joni Lee, Vice Chancellor for University Affairs & Chief Government Relations Officer for the University of Arkansas at Little Rock, April and Glen hear from Joni how she came to work in advocacy for UA-Little Rock with local, state and federal government for so many years. Joni discusses some highlights in her work, including the university’s Nanotechnology Center's success in securing a key role in development of creating bone for medical uses. As Joni traces changes she has seen over the years in her advocacy work, she notes the apparent change in how many in government have come to devalue the importance of higher education. She notices with disappointment how much more distrustful many in government have come to view those in higher education, with funding suffering as a result. She also observes how in today’s climate, “diverse viewpoints have become divisive views.” In one example Joni cites, she describes works to explain the reality and benefits of Diversity, Equity and Inclusion initiatives (DEI) to those in government and politics, despite DEI having recently been met with much skepticism or hostility.

#85, OTOH, Ann Clemmer, former state legislator, professor at UA-LR, current lobbyist, Part 2, Nov 4 2024

Wed, 04 Dec 2024 15:38:55 -0600

In this second part of our conversation with Ann Clemmer, a former state legislator, former professor, and current lobbyist, April and Glen explore Ann's views on effective strategies for working with government officials for the public good in an environment where civility and collaboration are not a given. She argues that moderation and compromise still hold promise in this environment because "parties are ultimately pragmatic - they want to win." Ann discusses avenues for citizen involvement that can influence not just electoral outcomes, but also legislation. The conversation with Ann includes her thoughts on how we can bridge political divisions (even in our families) and concludes with an anecdotal story of a legislative colleague who, in his passion, broke with legislative norms and an unwritten code of civility toward her Republican caucus on the floor of the House.

#84, OTOH, Ann Clemmer, former state legislator, professor at UA-LR, lobbyist, Part 1, Nov 4 2024

Wed, 04 Dec 2024 15:36:03 -0600

Glen and April welcome Ann Clemmer, a former state legislator and former professor at UA-Little Rock, for a conversation. Ann is currently a lobbyist with Capitol Consulting Firm. In this first part of our chat, Ann shares her early exposure as a child to politics and its continuing influence on her career choices and life. In spite of coming of age and getting elected in one of the most solidly Democrat states in the nation at the time, Ann then and since has consistently embraced a more Republican worldview. Ann describes how, as a state representative, she tried to work across divisions but found that even with support from those in her party, legislation sometimes failed due to the opposition party’s reluctance to yield a win. She describes this period of her career and the challenges faced by the minority Republican caucus as it eked forward from 28 out of 100 to the barest of majorities possible, 51 out of 100 in 2013. She shares the frustrating realities that made this kind of work difficult and her perceptions of the current tensions within Arkansas Republican party groups. As an Arkansas lobbyist/consultant now, with a large Republican majority in the General Assembly, Ann discusses the job of influencing legislative outcomes where conflicting pressures are at play. She describes with pride one project she engaged with that resulted in successful infusion of much needed resources for an especially vulnerable group of children in the state.

#83, OTOH, Phillip Fletcher, ordained minister, author, teacher, & nonprofit founder & CEO, Part 2, 10-17-24

Tue, 12 Nov 2024 13:03:44 -0600

In the second part of our interview with Dr. Phillip Fletcher, an ordained minister, author, teacher, & nonprofit founder, April and Glen explore his political leanings, which can vary, as he finds some commonality with both Reds and Blues, depending on the issue. While he works readily with people all across the spectrum, there are points beyond which he will not collaborate, especially if they are incompatible with his "north star" of respecting the dignity and worth of every human. He also asserts that "human beings want to be better" and he tries to help them accomplish this through his active work in the community. Finally, he talks about how Arkansas somewhat surprisingly wound up being his home, despite his initial time in California and the culture shock he experienced the first time he encountered a specific Arkansas cultural touchstone.

#82, OTOH, Phillip Fletcher, ordained minister, author, teacher, & nonprofit founder & CEO, Part 1, 10-17-24

Tue, 12 Nov 2024 13:02:55 -0600

April and Glen speak with Dr. Phillip Fletcher, an ordained minister, author, teacher, & nonprofit founder. As CEO of a nonprofit called The City of Hope Outreach, Phillip seeks to promote community development and "human flourishing" in education, housing, and nutrition, especially among the poor in central Arkansas. In this first of two parts, Phillip describes his values that led him to promote the "dignity and worth of every individual," especially with respect to education, nutrition, and housing. Phillip emphasizes the importance of finding contributions in everyone, including those persons that many would discount as either unable or unwilling to help themselves or others. He shares personal stories about how he has engaged the community in his efforts, despite many groups with differing goals or visions of how to help. Some key aspects he promotes in his work are doing the work necessary to understand the facts and beliefs important to those who may resist his efforts or views. Steeped in a philosophy of personalism, Phillip explains its origins and how it has been used in the activism of such leaders as Dr. Martin Luther King and others. Despite his strong religious beliefs, he acknowledges our society as a pluralistic culture and warns others not to let their faith lead them to become an extremist or zealot, nor to force others toward their viewpoint.

#81, OTOH, Patricia Matthews, Executive Director of the Interfaith Center of Arkansas, Part 2, 9-23-24

Thu, 17 Oct 2024 07:19:05 -0500

In the second part of our interview with Patricia Matthews, Executive Director of the Interfaith Center of Arkansas, April and Glen explore commonalities between interfaith approaches and those of Braver Angels' focus on political differences. Patricia then describes how she deals with issues such as the doubts of non-religious persons, potential conflicts between science and religion, and the impact on religion of extremists in the various faiths. Another element she sees as important in understanding the value of interfaith dialog came about from learning about a personal experience of a Muslim woman she worked with. This woman experienced a troubling encounter that revealed a hidden suspicion and stereotype held about her from someone she had encountered daily in her workplace for some time. In outlining some ideas for dealing with tensions that arise from differences of faith, Patricia reveals some of her personal approaches that help her maintain some peace of mind.

#80, OTOH, Patricia Matthews, Executive Director of the Interfaith Center of Arkansas, Part 1, 9-23-24

Thu, 17 Oct 2024 07:13:29 -0500

Glen & April talk with Patricia Matthews, an Episcopal priest and the new Executive Director of the Interfaith Center of Arkansas. In this first part of the interview, Patricia tells us about working with people of many different faiths, some of the challenges she encounters, and how they work through those obstacles. Patricia also shares with us a difficult moment she encountered earlier in her career when she was working with children of various faiths and was accused of doing the devil's work because of her respect for the actions of the kids she was working with when they engaged in rituals of their own faith. Her response to this challenge reflected what she sees as a key element in all faiths: love of God, self, and others. She notes the similarities between interfaith work and the efforts by Braver Angels to help others reach across political divides. Many approaches by both groups are similar, having a common foundation, including values much like the Golden Rule. One such instance she describes is how persons from various faiths struggled with dealing with the current issue of conflict between Israelis and Palestinians. Her response mirrors the approaches we discuss in both interfaith and Braver Angels work.

#79 OTOH, John O'Brien, producer of On the Other Hand & former Human Resources and public education professional, Part 2, 7 22 24

Mon, 30 Sep 2024 11:44:05 -0500

In the second part of our interview with our producer of this podcast, Glen and April explore with John O'Brien his work in the Texas public school system and his successful revamping of a curriculum for his seniors in high school language arts classes. Despite going against tradition and some of the state's requirements, John developed an entirely new and more practical exploration of literature that included many important life lessons for his students. His bold departure from tradition became popular with students and eventually was endorsed by other educators and administrators. John also describes how those working in education sometimes have their competence lead to ultimately difficult outcomes for them and the system. He offers suggestions for how the current direction in public education might be improved. John also offers a humorous story from his time working with a boss and a secretary, in which the interactions reached a crisis point, with a surprising conclusion.

#78 OTOH, John O'Brien, producer of On the Other Hand & former Human Resources and public education professional, part 1, 7 22 24

Mon, 30 Sep 2024 11:41:52 -0500

April and Glen welcome to the microphone someone who is usually handling our podcasts from the technical side: John O’Brien, who serves as producer and editor for On The Other Hand. John combines 33 years as a senior corporate human resources and training executive with thirteen years in public education. He also has decades of experience with technical aspects of video and audio editing. During his retirement, John has been active with community volunteering work as a member and an officer with Rotary International, Kiwanis International, Optimist International, Literacy Council, The United Way, Junior Achievement, and AmeriCorps. In this first episode, John briefly reviews his early adult life and influences, along with the development over time of his political leanings. Next, he takes us through significant moments in his experience handling even worldwide audio/visual broadcasts. John then provides insight into the world of corporate management and managerial/employee relationships. Based on his long experience, John offers key analyses on the dynamics at work in the private sector from the perspective of a Human Resources manager and the balancing act required in serving both sides and ultimately, the stakeholders and legal foundations of the business. Drawing parallels between his experience and the interest in Braver Angels of encouraging respectful negotiation of political differences, John also points out the differences and difficulties in the management/employee dynamics.

#77 OTOH Kent Myers, Braver Angels Arkansas leader, former city manager and consultant, part 2, 7 19 24

Thu, 05 Sep 2024 18:09:58 -0500

In part 2 of our conversation with former Hot Springs, AR city manager Dr. Kent Myers, April and Glen learn how he came to join Braver Angels Arkansas. His concern over the increasing incivility in our country and its many negative implications for citizens and government officials led him to find ways to help cope with those problems so prevalent in our society today. He suggests ways to improve the work of Braver Angels in Arkansas as it seeks to reduce polarization. Among his suggestions, Kent talks about the importance of life-long learning that he sees as a common element in leadership in Braver Angels. Going into his ideas of how we can all improve our work together, he talks about the "C's" that he sees as critical. Those key factors include collaboration, compromise, compassion, civility, and communication. Kent also explains key elements of two leadership approaches: Servant Leadership & Authentic Leadership. An optimist by nature, he talks of his hope for improvements in our political behavior in the future. Kent concludes the conversation with two touching stories of experiences in his own life and how it taught him to not wait to show love and concern for those you care about.

#76 OTOH Kent Myers, Braver Angels Arkansas leader, former city manager and consultant, part 1, 7 19 24

Thu, 05 Sep 2024 18:09:41 -0500

Glen and April talk with Dr. Kent Myers, one of the newer leaders in Braver Angels Arkansas. With a background of serving as a city manager in several cities over his career, along with his doctorate in leadership studies, Kent brings considerable expertise to his work with Braver Angels. In this first part of our conversation, Kent provides a brief bio of his career, then discusses the ways he has approached his role as city manager in several communities around the country, including Hot Springs, AR for 14 years. He briefly outlines the differences between mayoral and the city manager form of government, including specifics about the hybrid model that is used in Little Rock. Outlining some of the critical aspects of sound leadership, Kent talks about the importance of collaboration in working in any leader role. He also mentions recent new concerns among government officials that the polarized environment has exposed civic leaders to new concerns, including verbal or other attacks due to perceived political differences. He explains how the COVID pandemic impacted the increased hostility and how he learned to deal with these new challenges through forgiveness and transparency in his work.

# 75, John Davis, author and director of Pryor center for oral history, 6-19-24, part 2, OTOH

Tue, 13 Aug 2024 05:47:28 -0500

In this second part of our interview with Dr. John Davis, April and Glen delve into details from John's new book, “From Blue to Red: The Rise of the GOP in Arkansas.” In his book, John identifies 3 generations of the modern Republican Party in Arkansas, featuring highlights of Republican politicians from each generation. For example, the desire for political diversity by William Rockefeller helped inspire his entrance into the Republican Party. The 3rd and current generation of Republicans he sees as not yet knowing what it's like to lose. John also mentions Asa Hutchinson's current status in the Republican Party and from there talks about how to get back to bipartisanship in Arkansas. He also recounts an interesting story about Dr. Janine Parry, who is Founding Director of the Arkansas Poll and an expert in Arkansas Politics.

#74, John Davis, author and director of Pryor center for oral history, 6-19-24, part 1

Tue, 13 Aug 2024 05:47:08 -0500

Glen and April spoke with Dr. John C. Davis, a political scientist, researcher, and public servant and currently the executive director of the David & Barbara Pryor Center for Arkansas Oral and Visual History. In this first part of our interview, John discusses his work with the Pryor Center's Arkansas Oral History project, which features stories by and about Arkansans and Arkansas traditions. He traces some of the early influences of his family and values that led him to his life's work and views. Other details about his multi-faceted work are explored, including the influence on John of Bill Clinton's impeachment story, and his interest in working across political divides.

#73, Asa Hutchinson, former Arkansas governor and congressman, 7 10 2024

Tue, 23 Jul 2024 20:54:14 -0500

Glen and April had the chance to chat with Asa Hutchinson, an attorney and the previous 2-term Republican governor of Arkansas. Asa has a long history of public service, including serving as a US Congressman, one of the House managers for Bill Clinton’s impeachment trial in the Senate, head of the Drug Enforcement Administration, and chair of the National Governors Association. In the interview, Asa tells us about his current work, which includes working with a security firm, being a conservative teaching at a largely liberal major university, and his other new endeavors. We find out what he views as highlights of his career, including a successful, non-violent arrest and prosecution of a domestic terrorist group in Arkansas. His approach as governor is discussed, including how he handled the COVID pandemic by getting a variety of experts and weighing various views to help him find a way to manage Arkansas's approach to COVID that adhered to his conservative philosophy. While he outlines his strong conservative credentials, he also expresses concerns about several recent developments nationally, including issues he highlighted during his recent unsuccessful run for nominee of the Republican Party as President. We also hear his criticisms of how he sees his party as having moved away from traditional conservative values. He highlights his conviction that civility and compromise remain critical for the success of our government and explains how he remains hopeful that things will get better in the future, despite his several worries about what the immediate future may hold for us. He finishes with a story of an Iowa farmer's interesting reaction to him during a campaign related conversation.

#72, Jay McDaniel, author & theologian, 5 29 24, Part 2

Thu, 18 Jul 2024 08:12:44 -0500

In part 2 of our conversation with Dr. Jay McDaniel, April and Glen talk with Jay about his view of how a "virtuous life" was important to our nation's founders and is important in our current community, including those not just like ourselves. Jay explains the concept of process theology, and he suggests that a healthy religious life should have both "roots" and "wings." We also find out what gives him hope and helps him reach across divides, which includes beauty and the Bee Gees. We explore Jay's work in China to explore spirituality in that culture, and we hear about the importance of "moral humility" in reaching across divisions.

#71, Jay McDaniel, theologian, author & philosopher, 5 29 24, part 1

Thu, 18 Jul 2024 08:11:25 -0500

April and Glen chat with Dr. Jay McDaniel, a theologian, author & philosopher who specializes in Buddhism, process theology, interfaith dialogue, and spirituality in an age of consumerism. Jay has published many books and articles, and he has a blog called "Open Horizons" [www.openhorizons.org], which he previously titled "Jesus, Jazz, and Buddhism." Our conversation with Jay includes his perspective of politics having taken on many of the roles typically associated with religion, and how he seeks to "find shared Joys" as a means of reaching across differences with others. We also explore Jay's work with interfaith dialog, and how, as a Christian, he values Buddhist philosophy in his spiritual journey.

#70 Jay Barth, director of Clinton Presidential Library, 5-24-24, part 2

Thu, 27 Jun 2024 11:27:51 -0500

In part 2 of our conversation with Dr. Jay Barth, we cover a number of ideas, including the problems associated with an emphasis on "identity issues," the value in Arkansas of our ability to engage in "direct democracy" via citizen initiatives, and the Clinton Center's involvement (Braver Angels Arkansas is also a partner) in the Rockefeller Institute's "Civic Arkansas" project to improve citizen engagement in Arkansas. As a gay man, Jay understands and emphasizes the moral importance of people increasing their respect across various lines of identity in order to improve relationships and decrease conflict. Finally, Jay talks about two Arkansas politicians for whom he has great respect - Asa Hutchinson and David Pryor - due in part because of their pragmatic approach to dealing with differences and the examples they offer of respect across the political aisle.

#69 Jay Barth, director of Clinton Presidential Library, 5-24-24, part 1

Thu, 27 Jun 2024 11:26:59 -0500

Glen and April talk with Dr. Jay Barth, a native of Arkansas, who is the Emeritus Professor of Politics at Hendrix College, where he taught for 26 years. Jay currently serves as Director of the Clinton Presidential Library, and he has earned numerous awards for his work in education and politics over the years. In this first part of our conversation with Jay, he provides a brief biographical outline of his early life, born into a largely progressive family from which he developed many of his values. Jay also explains the three entities that make up the Clinton Presidential Center, with an emphasis on being non-partisan in its functions and outreach. While emphasizing the strong need for Americans to reach across political and other differences, he acknowledges the "Grand Canyon" divide our country presently is experiencing. To deal with this division, he speaks of values such as egalitarianism and resilience in helping us to continue our growth despite the obstacles.

#68 Mike Starr, author and life coach, 4-12-24, part 2

Fri, 14 Jun 2024 13:14:03 -0500

In the second part of our interview with author and life coach Mike Starr, April and Glen hear several of his specific concepts about how important it is to use language carefully in managing one's life and relationships. Some words he considers dangerous or tyrannical and he offers alternative words and phrases that he suggests can improve how one approaches problems in one's life. Rather than address politics directly, he prefers to focus on relationships. Interestingly, he advocates shaming in some cases, given his concerns about current trends of what he sees as decreased personal responsibility and increased blaming of external factors among many people. He ends with a personal story about how he and his canoe partner managed difficulties in their relationship during the long float from Pittsburgh to New Orleans.

#67 Mike Starr, author and life coach, 4-12-24, part 1

Fri, 14 Jun 2024 13:09:57 -0500

Mike Starr, life coach and author, speaks with April and Glen in this first part of our interview with him about his new book entitled, “Journey into Peace: A language for peace, progress, and healing,” in which he advocates that the everyday language we use causes much of the tension and suffering we have in our relationships. An entrepreneur who has managed a successful $100 million dollar a year manufacturing business, Mike is also a former nuclear submarine officer. He has also climbed Mt. Kilimanjaro and has canoed from Pittsburgh to New Orleans. He now lives in Arkansas. His upbringing in a family who experienced first-hand the effects of the holocaust helped inform his values and approach to life. In his conversation with us, Mike emphasizes the importance of respect and empathy in dealing with others, including as a means to limit negative reactions to problematic behavior on the part of others. He shares some of his key thoughts from his book about how to have a better life and relationships.

#66 Janet Harris, CEO of the Rockefeller Institute in Arkansas, 4-2-24, part 2: OTOH Episode 66

Sat, 27 Apr 2024 11:06:49 -0500

In part two, April and Glen gain ideas from Janet Harris, Executive Director & CEO of the Rockefeller Institute on Petit Jean Mountain, for helping various groups of Arkansans facing difficult differences to join together in finding common ground for problem-solving. Other topics covered include the importance of relationships in improving working relationships during this process, which prompted this quote from Janet: "the beauty of humanity is in that wrestling...". We review some of the initial efforts now underway with the institute and other groups (including our Braver Angels alliance) in helping promote civic engagement, which some data suggests is a particular problem in Arkansas. Other topics include addressing misinformation in our current media environment, Governor Rockefeller's initial motivation for running for office as a Republican (it's not what you might think), and a general description of how groups coming to the mountain for this process come to "wrestle with complexity" and how out of that process, she finds hope. Finally, Janet shares a remarkable story that started with her witnessing an aerial combat between two bald eagles while driving to work on top of Petit Jean mountain. The story serves as a fitting metaphor for the work of the Rockefeller Institute.

#65 Janet Harris, CEO of Rockefeller Institute in Arkansas, 4-2-24, Part 1: OTOH Episode 65

Sat, 27 Apr 2024 11:06:05 -0500

In this first part of our conversation with Janet Harris, Executive Director & CEO of the Rockefeller Institute on Petit Jean Mountain, Glen and April learn about the Rockefeller Institute, which is guided by former Governor Winthrop Rockefeller's belief that “...valuing diversity of opinion, practicing collaborative problem solving, and engaging in respectful dialogue combine to create transformational change.” As we explore the Institute's mission and Janet's role, she shares stories from her early life, including how playing high school and college basketball taught her many lessons in leadership. The many retreats held at the institute seek to help various groups of Arkansans who encounter "wicked problems" which have no clear way of solving them without compromise by the various stakeholders. Ground rules that help facilitate that outcome are presented, and she describes some specific groups and issues in Arkansas where positive outcomes have been achieved through this process. Janet encourages people of all sorts around the state to consider using the institute's facilities and staff when there is a need to solve a "wicked problem" with significant impediments to finding common ground and acceptable compromises. The natural setting on top of Petit Jean Mountain, the beautiful and comfortable facilities, and having meals and down time together help to move participants toward a better working relationship.

#64 Breanne Davis, AR state Senator & sponsor of 2023 LEARNS act, Part 2, Feb 20 2024; OTOH Episode 64

Fri, 22 Mar 2024 15:25:45 -0500

In this second part of our conversation with Breanne Davis, Republican Arkansas state senator from Russellville & sponsor of the LEARNS act in 2023, Breanne goes into some detail about the LEARNS law and how she views some resistance as due to misinformation about what it does. Acknowledging some genuine differences of view on this law, she describes how she feels it has important contributions to education in Arkansas. Other laws she sponsored and that were passed are reviewed, including helping ensure non-discriminatory access to healthcare for persons with Down syndrome. Asked to explain the extent to which she views 2nd amendment gun rights as having legitimate areas for regulation, she talks about some areas that are currently not well enforced, and she talks about proposed regulations such as Red Flag laws that she finds troubling. She concludes by talking about the importance of connection with other people in working on political issues, as well as need for reducing social media's negative, distorting influences. Civic engagement to her is served if we have "more community heroes and fewer keyboard warriors."

#63 Breanne Davis, AR state Senator & sponsor of 2023 LEARNS act, Part 1, Feb 20 2024; OTOH Episode 63

Fri, 22 Mar 2024 15:15:30 -0500

Breanne Davis, Republican Arkansas state senator from Russellville & sponsor of LEARNS act in 2023, sits down to talk with Glen & April in this first part of our conversation. Breanne's background growing up with a family that was active in their community and a longstanding interest in working with others motivated her to get involved, eventually running for and being elected as state Senator. She is a co-chair of the "Arkansas Futures Caucus," a bipartisan group of younger legislators who work together to get things done. Despite the history of partisan differences and tensions, she suggests that many in the legislature work together and get things done, but this seldom is covered adequately in the media. Breanne believes it is important to "fight less" both within and across parties, and this helps motivate her involvement in this caucus. She describes how caucus members work together, though there is disagreement in several areas, and how important she finds it to engage with others in person, rather than via social media. One distressing and puzzling part of her experience is what she calls "100 Percenters," those persons in her party who complain or respond with hostile language if she says or votes in any manner that doesn't fit entirely with their view of how things should be. This "perfectionism" often comes from people in her own party and who know her personally. While she believes strongly in compromise to get things done, she outlines some areas where her core beliefs do not lend her to compromising.

#62 Blake Perkins, ASU-Beebe history professor, Part 2, 2-2-24:OTOH Episode 62

Fri, 08 Mar 2024 13:20:14 -0600

In this second part of our interview with Dr. Blake Perkins, ASU-Beebe professor of history, we further explore his insights into the culture and politics of rural Arkansans in the Ozark region, who he terms "Ozarkers." In this episode, he provides additional detail into the reality, as opposed to stereotypes, of Ozarkers' frequently described distrust of outsiders. He includes lessons from history and his studies that suggest ways to reduce misunderstandings of people such as rural Arkansans, and he outlines some of the understandable and rational basis for some of their views. He also offers one model of how to use debate exercises in the classroom about historical events as a means of helping students to better appreciate diversity of views and ideologies, while promoting critical thinking about an issue. Current suspicion in some quarters about the value of higher education is also discussed. Dr. Perkins concludes with a humorous story of how another professor's energetic engagement with his class ended up revealing more of the professor than he likely wanted.

#61 Blake Perkins, ASU Beebe history professor, Part 1, 2-2-24:OTOH Episode 61

Fri, 08 Mar 2024 13:16:40 -0600

Dr. Blake Perkins, History professor at ASU-Beebe, talks with Glen and April about his research on the history of "Ozarkers" or rural folk in the Arkansas mountains over the last couple of centuries. He specifically addresses aspects of how these Arkansans have tended to view "outsiders," whether those from state or federal government, from more urban areas, or persons with money and influence. Given the importance of such divisions in understanding polarization in our current society, we felt it helpful to hear his insights, which not only are academic in nature, but also arise in part from his early life being born and raised in rural Arkansas. Blake talks in some detail about both the realities of this culture as well as some myths or stereotypes that don't always correspond to reality. He cites examples of "outsiders" who thrived in the Ozark culture, for example. We also delve into current controversies regarding potential changes in the status of the Buffalo River's national park designation, as well as the recent LEARNS law and its changes that pose some concerns to rural Ozarkers.

#60 Wendall Griffen, pastor, ex judge and social justice activist, Jan 30 2024, Part 2: OTOH Episode 60

Fri, 09 Feb 2024 15:26:29 -0600

In this second part of our talk with former judge and social justice activist Wendell Griffen, we hear his defense of the importance for civility in discourse and the willingness to engage with those on the other side. He points to how the games we played - and their rules that we followed as children - continues to be a critical model for us to follow as adults. He sees the need for similar attention to laws and civil behavior in our political discourse. Wendell also tells us about his experiences during a recent public forum on the Middle East conflict and how he and the other panelists, with strongly differing views, were able to follow guidelines and thus have a respectful and productive exchange of perspectives on this highly divisive topic. He offers reason for hope for our future in young people, who he sees as wanting civil discourse and as being willing to get involved in their community. Finally, he offers his thoughts on how each of us can make a difference in our community.

#59 Wendall Griffen, pastor, ex judge and social justice activitist, Jan 30 2024, Part 1: OTOH Episode 59

Fri, 09 Feb 2024 15:14:50 -0600

Here's a guest you should make a point to listen to: Wendell Griffen, a veteran, attorney, retired judge, CEO of his own organization, author, public speaker, and the pastor at the New Millennium Church in Little Rock. In part 1 of this interview, April and Glen sit down with Wendell, well known in Arkansas as a passionate advocate for various social justice issue. Here he explains how his views originate from influences by his parents growing up, as well Jesus, Martin Luther King, Jr, and others. He especially resonates with the call to "love the least of these." Wendell embraces a version of Christianity that he contrasts with what he terms "empirical Christianity," a version that troubles him and is covered in his upcoming book "The Hateful Faithful." Yet he urges being open to talking to others as critical for growth ("iron sharpens iron"). The struggle he sees is chaos vs community, where fear feeds chaos. He sides with the forming and strengthening of community. In a powerful metaphor, he relates a personal story that helped motivate him to be more active in his community. The inspiration came to him in learning to swim as an adult and led him to realize that we need the courage to "get off the side of the pool" and into the deep water in order to "learn how to swim."

#58 Ryan Norris, Director of Americans for Prosperity Arkansas, 11-13-23, Part 2: OTOH episode 58

Wed, 17 Jan 2024 10:07:20 -0600

In part 2 of his second appearance on our podcast, Ryan shares with us information about his work on increasing civil engagement by Arkansans. Those actions include initiatives that Americans for Prosperity Arkansas provides for any Arkansans who are interested in becoming more involved and engaged in political actions and advocacy. He also discusses how he combines advocacy for the conservative, free-market approach to government with strong support for cross-partisan engagement. Finally, we hear about his involvement in the recent movement to provide protection for Arkansas's nationally respected Freedom of Information law and how he and others from across the political spectrum are taking steps to maintain that level of transparency for Arkansas.

#57 Ryan Norris, Director of Americans for Prosperity Arkansas, 11-13-23, Part 1: OTOH episode 57

Wed, 17 Jan 2024 10:03:25 -0600

Glen & April invite Ryan Norris back for a repeat interview. As Director of Americans for Prosperity Arkansas, Ryan has been in charge of an organization that nationally has been associated with strongly Red views, yet he has persistently advocated and acted in accordance with values of civility and maintaining relationships across the political divide. In the first part of this second interview, Ryan provides insight into the importance he attaches to including people of various views in negotiations, as long as they maintain a respectful approach. He even advocates hearing from those with extreme views of either ideological slant, with the caveat that they remain civil in their approach. He provides details on some of the work his group has done with Arkansans in relation to bills considered in the 2023 legislative session.

#56 Robert Richards, Asst Prof, Clinton School of Public Service, 12-5-23, Part 2: OTOH Episode 56

Fri, 29 Dec 2023 13:25:03 -0600

In part 2 of our interview with Dr. Robert Richards of the Clinton School of Public Service, we learn about the various communication systems and practices that the students learn to help them appreciate the perspectives of others whose views differ from their own. Drawing distinctions between dialog and deliberation, Robert helps us better understand how students with such diverse cultural backgrounds and life experiences become effective practitioners of those and other approaches, thus making them valued members of the organizations with which they work. Robert's optimistic view of the future draws on the optimism he sees in these young (and some not so young) students. He sees that they share expectations that people of varying backgrounds and beliefs can communicate effectively and work together for goals that help move their organizations, and even countries, forward.

#55 Robert Richards, Asst Prof, Clinton School of Public Service, 12-5-23, Part 1: OTOH Episode 55

Fri, 29 Dec 2023 13:22:43 -0600

April & Glen welcome Dr. Robert Richards, Assistant Professor at the Clinton School of Public Service, who provides insight into the work done in training future professionals in government, non-profits, and for-profit organizations. For those who are curious about the nature of the Clinton School's vision and work with its students, Robert provides details on the training, both academic/research oriented work, as well as real-world experience in various companies and organizations or governments both in the US and around the world. We hear about the varied characteristics of those in the program, and perspectives of international students who come from differing cultural and government backgrounds, as they live and work in the US and are exposed to the American political and cultural environment. Robert also outlines several key communication and related techniques for having productive interactions with people of differing views.

#54 Clarke Tucker, AR state senator and attorney, 10-6-23, Part 2: OTOH episode 54

Tue, 12 Dec 2023 20:53:52 -0600

In part 2 of our interview with Clarke Tucker, Glen & April hear Clarke's account of recent work in the 2023 legislative session, including being able to get some long-sought measures in criminal justice reform included in a bill that became law. He describes its benefit in reducing recidivism and yet notes the many ways that some of that recent legislation is likely to prove counterproductive, failing to actually make Arkansans safer. He worries about the strong divisiveness between the parties in Arkansas and the country. Clarke provides an in-depth explanation of the factors that are contributing to or even worsening the current high level of tribalism and polarization, along with how certain democratic reforms that he feels would help reduce this problem. This conviction has led him to regularly file legislation that would help reduce this division by changing the primary system, but he has not yet been able to get enough support for its passage. However, he sees some hope for more bipartisan work recently in a couple of key areas, where persons across the political spectrum have been collaborating to support measures that would improve education in Arkansas and would strengthen and protect government transparency. He concludes with a humorous story of an experience he had while going door to door to garner support for his re-election.

#53 Clarke Tucker, AR state senator and attorney, 10-6-23, Part 1: OTOH episode 53

Tue, 12 Dec 2023 20:47:25 -0600

Glen and April sit down with Clarke Tucker, an attorney who currently serves as the Democratic Senator in the Arkansas Legislature from Little Rock, District 14. In this first part of our interview with Clarke, we learn how he serves in government out of a strong sense of obligation, given the many privileges he has been blessed with in his life. As we explore his view of politics in Arkansas and nationally, he explains how he sees the changes in recent years as "partisan, not political." He also provides insightful background into the nature of the legislative process in Arkansas these days, which is "grueling" in terms of the required fundraising and the strong pressure to "run with the party." Despite the realities of that current system, he tries to work for the people in his legislative activities. He believes that how one responds to that balancing act reveals the true nature of the politician. There are those who try to do honest work for the people of Arkansas, but too many are "posturing for re-election" and are only in it to win, seeing the process as merely a game.

#52 Nate Bell, former AR legislator, political consultant, government transparency activist, 10-18-23, Part 2: OTOH episode 52

Sun, 19 Nov 2023 18:09:16 -0600

In part 2 of our conversation with Nate Bell, Glen and April explore with him his work on the Freedom of Information law in Arkansas, his ideas on improving good government, and his suggested remedies for the extreme political polarization currently seen in our state and the nation. While describing himself as "bull-headed" in his political views, he values facts and is prepared to hear others who can provide legitimate information that may support an alternative view. His assessment of Arkansas's political environment now is one that has been unduly influenced by people on the extreme ends of political ideology, which he attributes to our primary system. He offers several concrete suggestions for alternatives that would lead to governmental actions more in line with the majority of Arkansans.

#51 Nate Bell, former AR legislator, political consultant, government transparency activist, 10-18-23, Part 1: OTOH episode 51

Sun, 19 Nov 2023 18:04:14 -0600

Nate Bell, a former Arkansas Republican legislator turned "politically homeless" and a consultant currently active in seeking to enshrine Arkansas's Freedom of Information law into the state constitution, sits down with Glen and April. Nate advocates for good government in his work, and he also consults on commercial and off-grid solar power projects. A self-described Reagan conservative, he draws a sharp contrast between his views and those currently seen in Arkansas's Republican community. As a result, he is working closely with a wide variety of Arkansans who differ strongly with him in some areas but find common ground in key areas such as governmental transparency and educational reform.

#50 Marquis Hunt, recording artist, interfaith leader, author and thought leader, 9-25-23, Part 2: OTOH episode 50

Sun, 12 Nov 2023 18:55:51 -0600

In this second part of our conversation with Marquis Hunt, we explore his life as a musician, and he offers sage advice on how to work across divides in his community. He offers advice such as "hate that which is not love" and points out how often these days, some divisive elements are targeting as "bad" such currently central points in the culture wars as being black, gay, transgender, etc. He focuses on finding ways to neutralize the efforts of those who try to vilify people who are different, which he associates with a form of hostage-taking. Drawing a distinction between those who design division societally and those who are caught up in this designed divisiveness, unaware that they are "unwilling co-conspirators," he emphasizes the importance of our approaching these two sources differently. He points out how we are built to handle toxicity in both physical, emotional, and more metaphysical ways as a way to empower us and offer a sense that we can make a difference. Marquis also talks about humility, the importance of being honest with oneself, and being in right relationship with oneself and others. The importance of appropriate boundaries turns out to be a rather widely encompassing notion that he uses, with concrete examples, that can help us "love anyway." His assertion is that everything he does, whether in music or in his work in the community, is in essence, listening and breathing, something he learned in his musical pursuits.

#49 Marquis Hunt, recording artist, interfaith leader, author and thought leader, 9-25-23, Part 1: OTOH episode 49

Sun, 12 Nov 2023 18:05:51 -0600

Glen & April talk with Marquis Hunt, an eclectic community leader who is also a talented saxophonist and recording artist, interfaith leader, author and thought leader. In this first part of the conversation, Marquis traces his origins in his upraising in Arkansas as a Christian, and how it has influenced his current views and work. He also explores his roles in our community as a person of faith who reaches across religious boundaries, as he shares some of his key notions about the intersection of personal morality and spirituality. His creation of an online program - The Flow - during the COVID pandemic led him to numerous conversations in response to the racially tinged environment that arose after the George Floyd and related incidents. He describes a public event at that time in which he took a conciliatory approach to those who often are in position, such as law enforcement, people of color, politicians, and others. Marquis shares his approach to dealing with those who are different, how one can respond with love despite being treated at times with bias or other forms of mistreatment. You'll find intriguing his comparisons of his work as a jazz musician with approaches to interacting with others in potentially difficult situations.

#48 Rex Nelson, veteran journalist and political/governmental figure, 9-27-23, single episode: OTOH Episode 48

Sun, 08 Oct 2023 16:07:11 -0500

Rex Nelson is a veteran journalist who also served in key roles in Governor Mike Huckabee's administration. In this interview with Rex (a single, 45-minute episode), we hear his take on the uniqueness of Arkansas and how it provides him a rich depth of topics for his columns, which include historical, cultural, political and other coverage of life in Arkansas. Some recent developments in the state are seen as offering Arkansas an important opportunity to grow economically and culturally, although he describes some concerns from current political developments in the state that may fail to take advantage of this moment. A long-time Republican, Rex explains his recent criticisms of the state and national Republican party and his desire for a return to what was historically considered conservative philosophy. He outlines key current political movements and media developments that he sees as jeopardizing our democracy and reviews some key potential efforts that could help move us back to a more healthy and effective democracy. He also contrasts how Mike Huckabee's governorship functioned with how the governor's daughter and current governor, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, has performed so far as governor. Tips are offered for how to get along with those who have differing political philosophies, and he suggests some areas of bipartisan agreement that have the potential to improve the current polarized state of Arkansas politics.

#47 John Brummett, prominent and long-time Arkansas journalist & columnist, 8-25-23, Part 2: OTOH Episode 47

Sun, 24 Sep 2023 17:04:28 -0500

In this second part of our interview with John Brummett, April and Glen hear John assert that "a steady, committed effort to human dialog" is a potential antidote to polarization. Currently, he views our nation as a "tied country" where the political math leads politicians to feed on division and pandering to the base of each party, while demonizing the other side. His solution is that moderates must become a movement on their own. The current state of the media, which is discussed in some detail, makes a movement from the middle particularly tough, as he feels our politics have become largely nationalized. Unfortunately, John feels this reality has made state and local news sources less relevant and influential in the community. Options for maintaining a healthy “media diet” are discussed. In addition to pushing for a more involved moderate element in this country, John advocates for "a movement for human connectedness." Finally, John sheds light on the evolution of his alter ego “Bubba” in his columns.

#46 John Brummett, prominent and long-time Arkansas journalist & columnist, 8-25-23, Part 1: OTOH Episode 46

Sun, 24 Sep 2023 16:59:46 -0500

Glen and April interview John Brummett, prominent long-time Arkansas journalist and columnist for the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette. John describes his early family life as a pivotal influence, and he relates an instance when he was criticized in his family's church for an article he wrote, and how his family responded. Also, he noted that while he generally did very well in elementary school, there was one area of conduct in which he persistently got poor ratings, and how this may explain his subsequent success in his career choice. Although he is widely viewed as liberal, John says he now is "formerly liberal, never conservative" and that he has disdain for extremes on both sides of the political spectrum (for example, he views some extreme leftists as "illiberal"). At this point, he believes neither main party now serves our country well. Instead, he advocates for a "muscular moderation" by persons in the broad center, whether right or left leaning. A key for him in doing this is via the strength of human connection.

#45 Kathy Webb, Little Rock city board member and longtime community activist in hunger, LGBTQ, and other issues, 6-21-23, Part 2: OTOH Episode 45

Sat, 16 Sep 2023 12:36:52 -0500

In this second part of our interview with Kathy Webb, Little Rock city board member and longtime community activist in hunger, LGBTQ, and other issues, Glen & April learn ways Kathy feels we can each help manage emotion and tribalism, in order to better work toward the common good. She mentions several areas in which she sees opportunities for bipartisan agreement or compromise, including public safety and crime, as well as homelessness. She shares her hopes and concerns for Arkansas, and then she concludes with a story about a powerful moment for her that involved famous (and now recently deceased) rock and R&B singer Tina Turner.

#44 Kathy Webb, Little Rock city board member and longtime community activist in hunger, LGBTQ, and other issues,, 6-21-23, Part 1: OTOH Episode 44

Sat, 16 Sep 2023 12:35:24 -0500

Glen & April interview Kathy Webb, Little Rock city board member and longtime community activist in hunger, LGBTQ, and other issues. In the first part of our interview, Kathy describes her early influences on her political views and activities as related to being raised as a "PK" or preacher's kid. Later, she came to identify with the feminist movement, and she also early on recognized the relative lack of opportunities for role models for gay/lesbian youth. All of these experiences, she feels, led her to grow and learn how to deal with being different from others. Later in her life when she was elected multiple times to the Arkansas legislature, she gained additional insight into how building relationships and compromise was critical to being effective. A recent influence was a book she read by author Monica Guzman (a previous guest on our podcast), who emphasizes curiosity as a way to reduce negative emotion and hostility in discussions, while building a closer relationship. She also described some work she and others have done in Arkansas recently to work toward civil discourse in the community, something she feels Braver Angels Arkansas can help promote.

#43 Lisa McNeir, retired psychologist & Braver Angels Arkansas alliance co-chair, 6-14-23, Part 2: OTOH Episode 43

Wed, 06 Sep 2023 22:52:25 -0500

In the second part of our interview with Lisa McNeir, retired psychologist & Braver Angels Arkansas alliance co-chair, Glen & April hear how Lisa's past experience as a school teacher suggests to her the value of including early education about human differences as important. She explains how this could be done via training of teachers to take advantage of daily opportunities in the classroom with students to promote tolerance and empathy, not necessarily as a specific course. Although Braver Angels promotes civility, she also points out ways that civility and politeness can serve as a cover for cruelty and to reduce chances for compromise if not utilized in good faith. As a former psychologist, she talks about the potential for teaching everyone basic emotion regulation skills as another avenue to help reduce the innate tendency to make political decisions based on largely unrecognized emotional/tribal factors. For Lisa, the critical issue in dealing with polarization is "what we are capable of vs what we choose to do." She sees connection with others as foundational if we are to improve our work in our country's political environment.

#42 Lisa McNeir, retired psychologist & Braver Angels Arkansas alliance co-chair, 6-14-23, Part 1: OTOH Episode 42

Wed, 06 Sep 2023 22:51:33 -0500

In this first interview with Lisa McNeir, retired psychologist & Braver Angels Arkansas alliance co-chair, Glen & April hear how Lisa’s positive impression with Braver Angel's training and approach in helping prepare its activists influenced her decision to help her local alliance carry out its mission. She points out the vulnerability many feel in speaking up about political views as an impediment to confronting toxic polarization. However, she suggests skills taught in Braver Angels, along with self-awareness and determination to be a better human being, can overcome this obstacle. She also advocates early education about human differences as a long-term approach with merit. While she views social media as a "beast" in worsening tribalism, she also feels each side has important contributions. For example, she sees the liberal view as "bringing people together" as a central principle.

#41 Nitin Agarwal UA Little Rock Professor and Social Media influence researcher, 7-18-23, Part 2: OTOH Episode 41

Wed, 30 Aug 2023 13:34:59 -0500

In part 2 of our interview, Glen and April discuss with Dr. Nitin Agarwal, professor and chair of the Information Sciences department at University of Arkansas at Little Rock, what he has learned about how bad actors around the world plan and implement influence operations online, including through information environment manipulation, mis/disinformation and propaganda campaigns. Dr. Agarwal explains how "social cyber forensics" is used to investigate "mal-information" online, how "adversarial AI" is being increasingly used in social media to negatively impact countries by other nation-states or groups who seek to sow discord in their enemies' culture, and the impact this has on democracies. His work with Arkansas government officials, the US defense establishment, and NATO has led his group to provide important insights into the potential harm that certain social media influence operations can cause, as well as to suggest ways to combat these destructive efforts. Nitin concludes with several ideas about how individuals, media platforms, and government can help work against these negative influence operations.

#40 Nitin Agarwal, UA-Little Rock Professor and Social Media influence researcher, 7-18-23, Part 1: OTOH Episode 40

Wed, 30 Aug 2023 13:30:48 -0500

Glen and April welcome University of Arkansas at Little Rock professor Dr. Nitin Agarwal, the Jerry L. Maulden-Entergy Chair & Distinguished Professor in the UA-Little Rock Information Science Department. Dr. Agarwal is also the Director of the Collaboratorium for Social Media and Online Behavioral Studies (COSMOS). His work focuses on influence operations online, information environment manipulation, mis/disinformation and propaganda campaigns that primarily originate outside the US and which potentially impact US defense strategic interests. As a subject matter expert on how social media is used to impact people and societies, such as through promoting toxic polarization and other negative consequences, Dr. Agarwal was interviewed to help us better understand what he and his team have found through his research about the ways that social media is being used in nefarious ways around the world. We also explore with him ways to improve our interactions with social media in our culture. In this first episode, Nitin describes the "good, bad and ugly" behaviors on social media, tactics, techniques and procedures used for online influence campaigns, and how social media, which originated with high hopes for positive use in society, has gone down a dark path in many ways currently.

#39 2023 Braver Angels National Convention recap with April Chatham-Carpenter & Ray Hanley, 8-11-23, Part 2: OTOH Episode 39

Wed, 23 Aug 2023 21:19:00 -0500

In this second part of Glen White's interview with Braver Angels Arkansas leaders April Chatham-Carpenter & Ray Hanley about their experiences at the 2023 Braver Angels National Convention, we hear April and Ray share their thoughts about the struggles they and most of us have in "walking the walk" in their work with Braver Angels. Maintaining a respectful approach to one's conversations, social media interactions, and other means of interaction with people of differing political views turns out the be a challenge for all of us. Yet both talk about examples of positive outcomes when using the skills and approaches espoused by Braver Angels, and the potential benefits of persisting even when our passion for advocating for our beliefs puts us in potential conflict with others. Based on what they learned during the convention, they provide some ideas about next steps for Braver Angels in Arkansas.

#38 2023 Braver Angels Convention recap with April Chatham-Carpenter & Ray Hanley, 8-11-23, Part 1: OTOH Episode 38

Wed, 23 Aug 2023 21:18:37 -0500

Glen White interviews Braver Angels Arkansas leaders April Chatham-Carpenter & Ray Hanley about their experiences at the 2023 Braver Angels National Convention. In this first of two episodes, Ray provides a background on the historic nature of the setting of the convention, while April describes the wide variety of events and activities that made up the first in-person convention since the COVID pandemic. "A Christian, a Jew, a Muslim, and a Wiccan walk into a convention..." - Sound like a bad joke? Nope, it's more like one of the more notable experiences Ray describes from his time at the convention. For music fans, April tells us about some of the musical moments during the convention, which included a group that combines hip-hop and bluegrass. Talk about your reaching across divides!

#37 Rebecca Glazier, UA-Little Rock political scientist & Associate Professor, 6-13-23, Part 2: OTOH Episode 37

Tue, 11 Jul 2023 14:07:46 -0500

In part 2 of our interview with Dr. Rebecca Glazier, Professor in UA-Little Rock's school of Public Affairs, Rebecca reveals strategies she employs for dealing with difficult, rigid people in her attempts to bridge differences, including "cross-cutting," as ways to build more positive relationships and interactions. An example is described in how a potentially difficult conversation about immigration led to finding several elements of common ground. Rebecca views religion as one of several potential means for bringing the right and left politically toward common ground. She used this approach in a "Race and Faith" summit of faith-based leaders in the community, and she outlines some of the both difficult and encouraging moments from that summit. Various negative societal influences, such as social media, gerrymandering, and others are described in terms of their tendency to increase polarization, as well as positive alternative strategies for broadening one's view of their "in-group." Rebecca points out how politicians are "single-minded seekers of re-election" and the implications of that reality on compromise as well as how to respond. She then concludes with additional ideas for how to reduce defensiveness when having political discussions.

#36 Rebecca Glazier, UA-Little Rock political scientist & Associate Professor, 6-13-23, Part 1: OTOH Episode 36

Tue, 11 Jul 2023 14:05:50 -0500

Dr. Rebecca Glazier, Professor in UA-Little Rock's school of Public Affairs, is interviewed about her work, including research with various faith communities in central Arkansas and their interests in community involvement. She works with her students and the community in trying to explore sources of division and polarization, as well as ways of reducing those tendencies. A key goal of her work is to learn more about the impact of religion, social identity and other factors that may contribute to division in the congregations and community. Initial work revealed a strong interest on the part of many congregations to look specifically at race as a topic that needs better understanding for overcoming tensions and silos in the community. Rebecca explores both positive and negative impact of religion in various areas, through a discussion of something she calls "ambivalence of the sacred." She also shares some of her classroom strategies for helping her class be a safe environment for having potentially difficult discussions for the students.

#35 Vic Snyder, former AR congressman, 4-25-23, part 2: OTOH Episode 35

Fri, 09 Jun 2023 13:09:17 -0500

In part two of our interview with Vic Snyder, he encourages citizens to not give up on their elected representatives. Vic expresses concerns about current Arkansas politics becoming more extreme than most voters, but he recognizes that campaigning often leads candidates to go to the extreme views of their party in order to get elected. However, when they get elected, they realize that governing isn't as easy as their campaigning views portrayed. Vic expresses concern about the influence of big money in politics, which can pose a danger to our democracy, the integrity of our elections, and our quality of life. He also shares lessons from his past involvement in the impeachment proceedings of Bill Clinton and how they might apply in today’s political environment.

#34 Vic Snyder, former AR congressman, 4-25-23, part 1: OTOH Episode 34

Fri, 09 Jun 2023 13:08:23 -0500

Glen and April sat down with former congressman from Arkansas 2nd district Vic Snyder recently. In this first episode, hear Vic’s views of bipartisan possibilities in Congress, based on his experiences as a congressman in the past. Vic describes some of the key things that he believes have contributed to the worsening of relationships in Congress. He also describes some potential areas of common ground that should be possible for Congress. Vic worked early in his career with Republicans, and in this interview, he expresses strong concerns about identifying too heavily with one party, and he expresses serious concerns about our current struggles in government. Vic, in his retirement, also is working on a fundraising initiative for a project recognizing the 1865 explosion and sinking of the Sultana steamboat, which was the largest maritime disaster in US history at that time.

#33 Rita Chisum Braver Angels activist 3-8-23: OTOH Episode 33

Wed, 19 Apr 2023 12:01:41 -0500

In this 2nd part of our interview with Braver Angels activist Rita Chisum, we hear Rita's thoughts about Truth (big T) versus truth (little t) and the importance of maintaining humility in one's beliefs about what we see as true. She explains some concerns she has about stereotypes some Blues may have about Reds, quotes Maya Angelou, and talks about her hopes for where Arkansas may be headed. She ends with strong assertions about respecting, listening to, and finding good in all people, not just those of the same political or religious persuasion.

#32 Rita Chisum Braver Angels activist 3-8-23: OTOH Episode 32

Wed, 19 Apr 2023 11:54:22 -0500

Glen and April interview Rita Chisum, an Arkansan and Braver Angels activist. In this episode, Rita describes how her family upbringing and strong Christian faith led her to being the person she is today. She also notes how those values drew her to the Braver Angels mission. As a Red politically, Rita ties her political views to her early influences, but she also notes her strong beliefs in respecting others who may disagree with her on politics, religion, and other topics. She emphasizes the importance of dealing directly but lovingly with differences one encounters when difficult conversations arise. Rita also suggests the value of providing early, developmentally appropriate education in psychology for young children, which she feels would help increase their empathy and skills for dealing with difficult issues they may face as they grow.

#31 Chris Jones, Democratic Party candidate, Part 2, 2-14-23: OTOH Episode 31

Fri, 31 Mar 2023 11:32:32 -0500

In part 2 of this conversation Glen and April have with recent Democratic candidate for governor Dr. Chris Jones, Chris describes the importance of authentic dialog in political conversations, with emphasis on a positive and respectful approach - including clarity in one's positions. He draws parallels between a divided legislative and executive branch in Arkansas during the Winthrop Rockefeller years with the potential for productivity even with possible future such divisions in Arkansas's government. Discussions include the importance of hearing from a wide range of voices when trying to solve difficult problems, potential areas of common ground between political factions in Arkansas, and the need to avoid demonizing other views, while continuing to call out destructive public assertions. He also covers how he views science and religion as being complementary and not necessarily being inconsistent with each other. He outlines recent attempts to broaden who he talks with in Arkansas as he hopes to build a more responsive and widespread involvement in political activities.

#30 Chris Jones, Democratic Party candidate, Part 1, 2-14-23: OTOH Episode 30

Fri, 31 Mar 2023 11:30:06 -0500

In this first part of a conversation with recent Democratic candidate for governor Dr. Chris Jones, Glen and April explore with Chris how he views his politics, some of the early life influences on his political views, and his strong belief that all points on the political spectrum can contribute to problem solving. He explains his approach to dealing with political differences, which includes preference for "high conflict" vs "conflict entrepreneurs." He also discusses the voluntary nature of our social contract and the need to "re-humanize" each other, and he compares the concepts of "calling out" vs "calling in" when faced with possible destructive political views and actions by others.

#29 Caroline Stevenson peace activist 1-20-23 Part 2 Episode 29

Mon, 20 Mar 2023 11:06:11 -0500

OTOH Episode 29: Part 2 of a conversation with Caroline Stevenson

This second episode of Glen and April's interview with long-time community activist Caroline Stevenson begins with her describing how she worked as a peace activist alongside members of the military in developing and funding the Beacon of Peace and Hope in North Little Rock and how both groups came to have enduring and respectful relationships despite their differences. Caroline explains her hopes in Arkansas for an eventual swing toward more moderation and mutual respect in its politics, which she saw during the Winthrop Rockefeller governorship. She recommends using one's own life experiences as a basis for taking action on matters of personal importance to each of us.

#28 Caroline Stevenson peace activist 1-20-23 part 1: OTOH Episode 28

Mon, 20 Mar 2023 11:04:56 -0500

Glen and April interview long-time community activist Caroline Stevenson, who has provided advocacy in areas such as mental health, peace, and interfaith relationships. In this first episode, Caroline discusses how the development early in life of a serious mental illness in one of her sons fueled her interest in mental health, which led her and a few other families in Arkansas to develop a state affiliate of the National Alliance on Mental Illness for support of families and reduction of stigma of mental illness. Caroline also disclosed how the death of another son in the PanAm airline bombing in 1988 initially led to bitterness and thoughts of vengeance, yet she chose to instead embark on a life-long attempt to reach across differences in religious beliefs. Additionally, she became active in peace movements, while still seeking to develop relationships with others who saw things differently, including members of the military.

#27 Monica Guzman, author and Braver Angels leader, 2-9-23, Part 2: OTOH Episode 27

Thu, 02 Mar 2023 14:25:24 -0600

In this 2nd episode of a conversation with journalist, national Braver Angels leader, and best-selling author Monica Guzman, April & Glen explore with Monica her assertion that "people underrepresented in our lives are overrepresented in our imagination" and how that requires us to get to know more people who differ from us. She points out how talking with those others helps us to check our darker visions with the realities we find when we talk with curiosity with others. Monica identifies politics and journalism as two key institutions that may be mostly responsible for our current polarization but that they can also be our best hope for helping solve those problems. They can change by learning and incorporating the best new ideas of our current people and culture. Seeing many opportunities for discovering common ground across our various groups, Monica tells stories of how others have grown closer via their discovery of unexpected common ground. She describes the "temperamental revolution" required of all of us, especially politicians whose yelling in public discourse is often an audition for media appearances. Finally, she talks about her hopes for our country and culture and asserts that "there is no one not worth talking to."

#26 Monica Guzman, author and Braver Angels leader, 2-9-23, Part 1: OTOH Episode 26

Thu, 02 Mar 2023 14:12:06 -0600

Glen & April welcome Monica Guzman, a journalist, Braver Angels national leader, and best-selling author of the book "I Never Thought of It That Way: How To Have Curious Conversations in Dangerously Divided Times." In this first episode, Monica traces her journey in journalism as she encounters pressure to take sides and instead commits to promoting multiple voices and perspectives. She describes how an extended conversation with someone on the other side taught her to be patient in order for an understanding and relationship to develop, so that each of them could recognize flaws on their side and acknowledge good points on the other side. She emphasizes the importance of this complete understanding in revealing truth, and how that approach requires intellectual humility, curiosity, and courage in the face of uncertainty. When so much of us easily view others as monsters or as posing an existential threat to our way of life or our identity, Monica notes the role of fear in this process, and how it greatly distorts the reality and the truth that can ultimately bring us together.

#25 Ray Hanley, AR government and private sector leader, 12-1-22, Part 2: OTOH Episode 25

Mon, 16 Jan 2023 21:10:07 -0600

In Episode 25, Ray Hanley defends his efforts to support government programs that help kids and families with healthcare access as being consistent with a conservative, pro-family and pro-business approach. He also talks in some depth about how he was able to persuade many persons on the value of such programs to their community. As someone who has spent much of his career as a conservative but who sometimes takes positions not usually associated with a Republican philosophy, he describes lessons he has learned about how to successfully negotiate or talk with persons generally in opposition to his ideas. He ends with his analysis of the likely future of Arkansas politics in coming years.

#24 Ray Hanley, AR government and private sector leader, 12-1-22, Part 1: OTOH Episode 24

Mon, 16 Jan 2023 21:09:54 -0600

In Episode 24, we feature Part 1 of an interview with Ray Hanley, a long time figure in Arkansas politics and in the private sector. He served, for example, for 7 years as an executive in EDS, the technology company headed by Ross Perot. Ray also has had extensive service in Arkansas government, including his time in the Huckabee administration when he played a key role in getting Medicaid expansion for children passed (ARKIDS First). He also helped spearhead the effort for Arkansas to adopt Medicaid expansion under the Affordable Care Act years later. Despite his generally conservative views politically, Ray has faced criticism from some Republican quarters for these and other stances. He explains how he views his positions as very consistent with a conservative, pro-family and pro-business approach.

#23 Sherry Simon, vice-president of Pax Christi AR, 10-13-22 Part 2: OTOH Episode 23

Sun, 04 Dec 2022 13:15:26 -0600

In part 2 of their conversation with Dr. Sherry Simon, psychologist and leader in Pax Christi AR, April and Glen explore with Sherry strategies for handling difficult moments in the work she does. In addition to approaches derived from her profession as a psychologist, Sherry also discusses ways that mindfulness-based approaches help her deal with the blowback she and others in Pax Christi sometimes experience from those who may not agree with their work. Glen and April also weigh in with insights from their professional and personal experiences in dealing with difficult conversations.

#22 Sherry Simon, vice-president of Pax Christi AR, 10-13-22 Part 1: OTOH Episode 22

Sun, 04 Dec 2022 13:14:12 -0600

April and Glen talk with vice-president and board member of Pax Christi, Arkansas, psychologist Dr. Sherry Simon. Pax Christi is a Catholic organization devoted to the pursuit of peace. Sherry talks about the work Pax Christi does, how persons of various political views work together for the cause of peace, and how her knowledge and skills as a psychologist help her in this work. She discusses the active approach required in a pursuit of peace.

#21 David Childs, Red co-coordinator for Braver Angels in Arkansas, 8-5-22 Part 2: Episode 21

Tue, 18 Oct 2022 12:06:29 -0500

In part 2 of this conversation, April and Glen speak with David Childs, Red co-coordinator for Braver Angels in Arkansas, about why he joined Braver Angels. David describes his past experiences with serving in public office and as a government employee, and how his time in Braver Angels has led to an evolution in how he interacts with others during political conversations.

#20 David Childs, Red co-coordinator for Braver Angels in Arkansas, 8-5-22 Part 1: Episode 20

Tue, 18 Oct 2022 12:04:18 -0500

In this first part of a conversation that April and Glen have with David Childs, Red co-coordinator for Braver Angels in Arkansas, David talks about why he joined Braver Angels. David describes his past experiences with serving in public office and as a government employee, and he offers his views on the pros and cons of government being run as a business vs a public endeavor. He also talks about his book that addresses issues in management of organizations.

#19 Part 3 of 3 Red Blue conversations between Glen and April about potentially controversial excerpts about research into political polarization, 10-11-22: OTOH Episode 19

Wed, 12 Oct 2022 16:07:34 -0500

This is the final of 3 parts of a sort of "Red-Blue" discussion, in which Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter (co-hosts of this podcast) talk out issues related to a recent series of podcasts on polarization research. In several previous episodes, Glen and Jerry Henderson had an extended conversation in which they explored various aspects of the research and scientific theories regarding political polarization. A few brief excerpts from those conversations were explored by Glen and April, who discuss those excerpts in some detail, describing initial reactions to the points raised in the initial discussions by Glen and Jerry, as well as getting into a broader exploration of the rationale and implications for the excerpted points. We conclude our discussion with comments on the politicization of the science regarding the COVID pandemic, how context can determine whether certain personality or brain differences between liberals and conservatives are advantages or disadvantages, and we assess how our initial experiment in a Red/Blue conversation turned out.

#18 Part 2 of 3 Red Blue conversations between Glen and April about potentially controversial excerpts about research into political polarization, 10-11-22: OTOH Episode 18

Tue, 11 Oct 2022 13:59:27 -0500

In this second of a 3 part "Red-Blue" discussion, Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter (co-hosts of this podcast) exchange views on issues related to a recent series of podcasts on polarization research. In several previous episodes, Glen and Jerry Henderson had an extended conversation in which they explored various aspects of the research and scientific theories regarding political polarization. A few brief excerpts from those conversations were explored by Glen and April, who discuss those excerpts in some detail, describing initial reactions to the points raised in the initial discussions by Glen and Jerry, as well as getting into a broader exploration of the rationale and implications for the excerpted points.

#17 Part 1 of 3 Red Blue conversations between Glen and April about potentially controversial excerpts about research into political polarization, 10-11-22: OTOH Episode 17

Tue, 11 Oct 2022 11:00:39 -0500

This is part 1 of 3 parts of a sort of "Red-Blue" discussion, in which Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter (co-hosts of this podcast) talk out issues related to a recent series of podcasts on polarization research. In several previous episodes, Glen and Jerry Henderson had an extended conversation in which they explored various aspects of the research and scientific theories regarding political polarization. A few brief excerpts from those conversations were explored by Glen and April, who discuss those excerpts in some detail, describing initial reactions to the points raised in the initial discussions by Glen and Jerry, as well as getting into a broader exploration of the rationale and implications for the excerpted points.

#16 Final (5 of 5) episode of an extended conversation between Jerry Henderson & Glen White, as they discuss political polarization research, and how to reduce polarization, 6-30-22: OTOH Episode 16

Thu, 29 Sep 2022 16:48:50 -0500

This fifth and final part of the conversation between Jerry Henderson and Glen White concludes their review of a number of key understandings of political polarization from social sciences research and opinion leaders. This episode reviews key cognitive errors in our thinking that contribute to polarization, and we offer several evidence-based solutions that may help reduce polarization in ourselves and our society. Check out the other episodes on this topic as we cover the many complications of dealing with political polarization, especially at the toxic level seen in today's society. Learn why political beliefs are so hard to change, and what can help us do better at depolarizing our personal and national conversations.

#15 4th of 5 episodes of an extended conversation between Jerry Henderson & Glen White, as they discuss political polarization research, and how to reduce polarization, 6-30-22: OTOH Episode 15

Thu, 29 Sep 2022 16:48:34 -0500

This fourth of five parts features the conversation between Jerry Henderson and Glen White as they continue their review of a number of key understandings of political polarization from social sciences research and opinion leaders. This episode discusses influences that contribute to polarization, evolutionary factors that have led humans to be susceptible to polarization (including parasite stress leading to development of social and group factors), and moral influences that relate to our political belief development. Check out the other episodes on this topic as we cover the many complications of dealing with political polarization, especially at the toxic level seen in today's society. Learn why political beliefs are so hard to change, and then in our final episode, part 5, learn what can help us do better at depolarizing our personal and national conversations.

#14 3rd of 5 episodes of an extended conversation between Jerry Henderson & Glen White, as they discuss political polarization research, and how to reduce polarization, 6-30-22: OTOH Episode 14

Wed, 28 Sep 2022 21:50:00 -0500

This third part of the conversation between Jerry Henderson and Glen White continues their review of a number of key understandings of political polarization from social sciences research and opinion leaders. This episode includes how behavior of leaders and other public figures can have serious impacts on the responses of citizens to political battles, how that impact can spread almost like a pandemic, and the impact of media, including the spread of inaccurate information in society. The impact of emotions and how they can override rational considerations is explored. This primacy of heart over head helps to drive tribal decision-making for all of us to some degree. Check out the other episodes on this topic as we help you better appreciate the complications of dealing with political polarization, especially at the toxic level seen in today's society. Learn why political beliefs are so hard to change, and what can help us do better at depolarizing our personal and national conversations.

#13 2nd of 5 episodes of an extended conversation between Jerry Henderson & Glen White, as they discuss political polarization research, and how to reduce polarization, 6-29-22: OTOH Episode 13

Tue, 27 Sep 2022 21:01:00 -0500

In part two of their conversation, Jerry Henderson and Glen White discuss key understandings of political polarization from social sciences research and opinion leaders. In this second part of their conversation, we discuss several negative impacts of extreme political polarization, with reference to how current and long-standing psychological processes suggest mechanisms for how societal stress and behavior are impacted by the strong emotional discord that politics currently evokes in our society. Be sure to check out the other episodes on this topic as we cover other important considerations for our societal and governmental well-being when we allow extreme polarization to persist. We hope this information will help you better appreciate why political beliefs are so hard to change, and what can help us do better at depolarizing our personal and national conversations.

#12 1st of 5 episodes of an extended conversation between Jerry Henderson & Glen White, as they discuss political polarization research, and how to reduce polarization, 6-29-22: OTOH Episode 12

Mon, 26 Sep 2022 08:46:00 -0500

Jerry Henderson and Glen White discuss key understandings of political polarization from social sciences research and opinion leaders in this first episode of their conversation. This complex area of political polarization requires exploration of many well-established psychological principles as well as more recent research and the ideas experts in the field. Numerous factors, including neurological, social, cultural, and evolutionary forces (many of which are emotional and largely unconscious) influence our political beliefs and behavior and how we respond to differing opinions of others. Be sure to look for later episodes on this topic that we hope will help you better appreciate how complicated humans are when politics are concerned.

#11 Daniel Reimer, Baha’i faith leader in AR and organizer of Meaningful Conversations, 6-22-22, Part 2: OTOH Episode 11

Mon, 19 Sep 2022 13:25:22 -0500

In this second part of Glen and April's interview with Daniel Reimer, a member of the Baha'i faith, an organizer of the online event Meaningful Conversations, and a patient advocate at UAMS, Dan describes how he views values and concepts found in most faith communities as helpful in being able to reach across divides with others.

#10 Daniel Reimer, Baha’i faith leader in AR and organizer of Meaningful Conversations, 6-22-22, Part 1: OTOH Episode 10

Mon, 19 Sep 2022 13:24:49 -0500

Glen and April interview Daniel Reimer, a member of the Baha'i faith, an organizer of the online event Meaningful Conversations, and a patient advocate at UAMS. Dan describes how he views values and concepts found in most faith communities as helpful in being able to reach across divides with others.

#9 Gwen Faulkenberry, teacher and author from rural Arkansas, 6-8-22, Part 2: Episode 9

Tue, 09 Aug 2022 18:17:40 -0500

On the Other Hand co-hosts Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter interview Gwen Faulkenberry, a teacher and author who has a blend of political views but ran unsuccessfully as a Democrat for the state legislature in her rural district. Learn more about Gwen's political views and her involvement with a new organization, Arkansas Strong. This is part 2 of our interview with Gwen.

#8 Gwen Faulkenberry, teacher and author from rural Arkansas, 6-8-22, Part 1: Episode 8

Tue, 09 Aug 2022 18:16:33 -0500

On the Other Hand co-hosts Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter interview Gwen Faulkenberry, a teacher and author who has a blend of political views but ran unsuccessfully as a Democrat for the state legislature in her rural district. Learn how her faith and family inform her political views and her community activities, as well as some disturbing responses she got when she chose to run as a Democrat. This is part 1 of our interview with Gwen.

#7 Ryan Norris, Americans for Prosperity Arkansas Director, 5-3-22, Part 2: OTOH Episode 7

Thu, 04 Aug 2022 15:40:52 -0500

April and Glen interview Ryan in the second part of this series, finding out more about how he works as director of Americans for Prosperity in Arkansas, and he describes helping coordinate efforts to reach across the partisan divide in the state legislature to pass some legislation in the most recent session.

#6 Ryan Norris, Americans for Prosperity Arkansas Director, 5-3-22, Part 1: OTOH Episode 6

Thu, 04 Aug 2022 15:39:46 -0500

Glen and April interview Ryan Norris, Arkansas director of Americans for Prosperity. AFP has a long reputation for advocating free-market based and other conservative positions and policies around the country. Despite a history of enmity with progressive positions and politicians, AFP has indicated recently their desire to move toward a more collaborative and civil relationship with those who have differing views. Ryan explains current activities and philosophy of AFP, focusing on efforts in Arkansas in recent years.

#5 Braver Angels Arkansas leader Kwami Abdul-Bey, a racial justice entrepreneur and student at the Clinton School of Public Service, May 3, 2022, Part 2: OTOH Episode 5

Thu, 14 Jul 2022 08:45:55 -0500

On the Other Hand co-hosts Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter interview Braver Angels Arkansas leader Kwami Abdul-Bey, a racial justice entrepreneur and student at the Clinton School of Public Service. In this second of two episodes with Kwami, learn more about what Kwami does in his many activities within the community and how he works together with others having different political views.

#4 Braver Angels Arkansas leader Kwami Abdul-Bey, a racial justice entrepreneur and student at the Clinton School of Public Service, May 3, 2022, Part 1: OTOH Episode 4

Wed, 13 Jul 2022 08:34:22 -0500

On the Other Hand co-hosts Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter interview Braver Angels Arkansas leader Kwami Abdul-Bey, a racial justice entrepreneur and student at the Clinton School of Public Service. Learn more about what Kwami does in his many activities within the community and how he works together with others having different political views. This is part 1 of our interview with Kwami.

#3 Jeannie Burrus and Mary Hunt, Braver Angels Arkansas Leaders, March 2022, Part 2: OTOH Episode 3

Wed, 06 Jul 2022 15:59:44 -0500

Glen and April continue their interview with Braver Angels Arkansas leaders Jeannie Burrus and Mary Hunt. While they represent different political views, they talk about common reasons they joined Braver Angels and how they are able to work to reduce polarization in themselves and in their own relationships.

#2 Jeannie Burrus and Mary Hunt, Braver Angels Arkansas Leaders, March 2022, Part 1: OTOH Episode 2:

Wed, 06 Jul 2022 15:59:38 -0500

On the Other Hand co-hosts Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter interview Braver Angels Arkansas leaders Jeannie Burrus and Mary Hunt in March 2022. Learn more about what Braver Angels does and these leaders' ability to work together despite having different political views. This is part 1 of our interview with Jeannie and Mary.

#1 Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter, OTOH co-hosts introduce On the Other Hand Podcast and Our Vision:2-15-22: OTOH Episode 1

Wed, 06 Jul 2022 15:59:29 -0500

In this first episode of our On the Other Hand Podcast, co-hosts Glen White and April Chatham-Carpenter introduce the vision and goals for the podcast and provide a brief overview of our sponsor, Braver Angels Arkansas, along with information on political polarization.